Yea... Tards and paid shills all day here

[deleted]

It's like clockwork

Well it's simple actually, they have software which notifies them when certain topics arise and the troops are dispatched.

this cannot be said enough

Gotta give them props for being well organized, albeit manipulative and sleazy. I kinda wish reddit displayed users flags in the same way 4chan does, at least that way I know who's potentially astroturfing.

So easy to spot and ignore anyway....

In /r/conspiracy yes but in some of the more popular subs like /r/worldnews some people would call you bat shit crazy for pointing out the truth of what they do.

r/worldnews is full of brainwashed fools.

So that is why you people never engage in rational discourse here. You think people who come here for rational debate are paid shills astroturfing so you don't engage in the process of defending your positions with evidence or a rational argument. This is a defense mechanism designed to maintain your delusions and conspiratorial world views. You should write a person off when they stop having evidence and rational arguments to support the positions they are arguing, not just because they are arguing a position that you disagree with. This is pure willful ignorance and confirmation bias.

I wonder who's paying them

Where can I read about the Israel involvement in this? I read about Rothschild taking down the one over the ocean but I haven't heard about this one

I've been preaching that the WHOLE time. They were also behind Pearl Harbor but no wants to believe me but the truth will come out in a decade or two.

Post some evidence then, and if you do, definitely PM me. I'm open minded but there has to be something behind the statement.

These damn Jews.

You know that RT is owned by the Russian government right? Of course they are going to try to shift blame to Israel haha

Welcome. We were just talking about you.

Ahh, the old "ignore the evidence" thing that you people use

What? A news website titled "Russia Today" is owned by Russia? THIS IS A STUNNING PIECE OF DETECTIVE WORK, SIR!

Is USA Today owned by the US? No.

But "The Voice of America" is. The USA has its own state-owned propaganda outlet, surprise, surprise.

That RT is owned by Russia is not evidence of anything. So there is nothing to ignore.

Them peddling russian propaganda and seriously trying to fucking blame isreal for taking down mh17 is enough to completely discredit them

You've just discredited every major media outlet in the world. Give yourself a pat on the back.

You know that CNN/MSNBC/FOX/NBC/ABC are controlled by Israeli & US government interests?

Hmm...maybe the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

Yeah and American media is owned by????

I almost read that as "tardis" that would explain why they came out of nowhere.

Fat neckbeard nerd kids from r conspiratard

Just means the good folk have to work that little bit harder.

It's a sign of success; the more we are infiltrated, the more concerned they show themselves to be. As others have noted, always go to r/new, and look for the stuff being voted down fast. Recognized the trolls and shills by name.

They are afraid. They are cowards. The time of change may well be near. I suspect they will do all they can to get Reddit offline when it happens, whatever "it," is.

Exactly I'd rather have shills then it being a ghost town here, I mean look at the subscribers this is a nice sized group of free thinkers

once you learn to spot them they actually help to detect important topics or posts.

Furthermore... these "paid" guys are being exposed to industrial levels of hard truth on a daily basis... More than likely, when their enlistment is up, they'll all be born-again conspiracy theorists, brave and true.

[deleted]

It's a positive sign only if we adapt and move on from this already infiltrated outlet. Otherwise the joke is on us.

/r/new is banned? What was it?

They meant /r/conspiracy/new/

Lo, a harvest moon rises.

I love that paranoid reasoning: "how can we explain, there is a massive amount of people who thniks we are morons?" - "Simple, that's because they are all paid agents of the reptilians\muslims\liberals\jews... not because we are not able to understand how to make a fucking rationale and fact-checked argument."

Religious use exactly the same fallacy : they say that the earth is round, so they are evil.

Quite the stream of consciousness word salad here. Had to read it a couple times to figure out what you're saying. You are not a worthy adversary.

Get an education on shills before you speak on a subject and look like a fool.

Yes, this place is heavily manipulated as is to be expected. Any place that has a large enough user base will be a target of programs like JTRIG. Research the methods of programs like JTRIG so you can understand their techniques. Use this as a place to get ideas to research yourself, but don't put too much weight into comments and voting. Always view by /new. Observe the topics in the /new queue that are hammered with downvotes quickly. Those are probably topics worth looking in to.

Identify for yourself the commenting users who participate in this behavior. FortHouston is a pretty obvious example, as is BillionaireBob.

Navigating through this mess is a lot of work, but it is probably worth it.

Aren't you one of the guys that is always posting about how the earth is flat?

not every theory is worthy of discussion. i'm not saying it should be censored, but i do think it detracts from the sub.

He's claiming that shills are downvoting "important topics", while he spends his time here talking about a theory that was literally invented by satirists as a method of mocking "science deniers".

literally invented by satirists as a method of mocking "science deniers".

Have any source for that?

Not a flat earther but you can't talk out of your ass after talking about "detracting from the sub".

Labelling a theory "not worthy of a discussion" is called pre-censorship. Same reason why 9/11 is a taboo subject in the MSM.

Free-thinking means ANYTHING is on the table, no matter how silly it may seem.

Ok, I think the moon is made of cheese. Anyone who downvotes me is a shill.

We have to be discerning. remember when you were in kindergarden and your teacher told you there was no such thing as a stupid question? Your teacher was wrong. Don't waste the class's time with stupid questions.

Did somebody say cheese?

And who decides what is/isn't a stupid question? Is this something that is universally understood on all levels (not just moon cheese)?

People are responsible for their own logic. Flat earthers are going to get downvoted by community members who think their "theory" detracts from the sub content. That doesn't make me a "shill", that means that I don't think their posts contribute any value.

A discussion is a discussion, this is a sub that should be w/o a mainstream narrative of any sort (or at least not discriminate).

You downvote posts that don't contribute to any discussion. If you don't believe in entertaining a theory as a creative thought process, you can simply not upvote and move on.

There is value in everything my friend.

No. Not really. I'm sorry your special snowflake worldview is harmed by that fact. Buck up kiddo.

I think you need a hug, you have a very negative attitude.

No, just very sick and tired of being called a shill because I don't automatically accept that reptilian aliens control the world.

That is where you are mistaken my friend, this is a place for discussion. While I agree that some people will try and shove it down your throat, there are far more people who try and end all discussion on the topic because it goes against their beliefs.

I thought we were discussing your fallacious argument that all discussion is valuable.

Correction: Everything has value.

No. Not everything does. Everything has cost.

If the cost of X is less than the value of X, it does not have value.

Something can't have simultaneously have a value and not have a value... The word you are looking for is profit.

You take a philosophical approach to what others would consider useless conversations.

While there may be something of interest in going down every dead end in a maze on one's way to the exit, if the maze is large and the time you have to explore it limited, traveling down dead ends is a waste of one's limited resources.

Flat Earth theory is a corridor with no turns - it's easy to see it's not worth spending one's time exploring. Of course many would rather not have that here - it's seen as a distraction, nothing more.

However, I think the freedom to talk about nonsense theories, that they are at least allowed, makes it easier to talk about other things which are far out there that may or may not have merit.

What sorts of topics interest you?

This would be the earth if flat earth is correct.

I see night like every night, how do you explain night according to flat earth?

The Sun revolves around Earth. Duh!

Haha, wrong. Somethings are so mind blowingly stupid that they are not worthy of discussion. Flat earth falls firmly in that camp, it's been proven wrong for the past 500 years and you can see the curvature from the tops of mountians or on the ocean. You literally have to be living underground to miss the proof. Which probably isn't too far of a stretch, parents basement = underground.

Wrong/right is not the point. It's about being open and discussing anything despite how silly it sounds to you (subjective).

Even Plato, Copernicus, etc. were met with extreme opposition in their time by people like you. Yet today, you accept their findings as fact.

Haha, and they proved that the earth was round and that the earth orbited the sun with mathematics and observation, they provided the proof required to overturn the established theory. Flat earthers have shit tons of math (every part of physics works because the world is round) and observable phenomenon to debunk before they can even begin to discuss whether the earth is round or flat. But we get no proof, just a bunch of conjecture and misunderstandings, The people pushing this theory today are not a copernacus or plato. To be considered a thinker like those men, they have to provide evidence, instead, just spew unbacked or easily debunked claims and want everyone to trust them. I'm sorry, I can fly around the world, thus the world is round that alone debunks the entire hypothesis. It takes a serious lack of understanding of the pysical world to even consider such a stupid hypothesis.

Whenever a person lacks information or understanding of something, they make assumptions about it. This is the nature of ALL conspiracy theories. Lack of information leads to conspiracy theories being believed and a susceptibility to believe anything in regards to what they don't know about.

"Free-thinking means ANYTHING is on the table, no matter how silly it may seem."

which is precisely the cover that trolls use to exploit.

In which case you can simply ignore them.

or prove them wrong for those who don't know better to see why they should

Not really. We don't need to discuss whether birth via vagina is real or not, or if cheese is made from milk. These things are facts, and need no discussion. The earth is not flat, there's no evidence to support that it is and all evidence points to it being bs. It detracts from serious conspiracy theories and is just as bad as the shills.

a theory that was literally invented by satirists as a method of mocking "science deniers".

Well, this simply isn't true. There's been much debate and disagreement about the nature of the planet and the cosmos for literally thousands of years with many schools of thought gaining and falling out of favor over the centuries. The earth wasn't "accepted" as being round until a few hundred years ago and the idea that the earth may not be round wasn't invented by satirists, it's a far older idea than that. I don't know where you got that from.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_flat_Earth

The myth that people in the Middle Ages thought the earth is flat appears to date from the 17th century as part of the campaign by Protestants against Catholic teaching. But it gained currency in the 19th century, thanks to inaccurate histories such as John William Draper's History of the Conflict Between Religion and Science (1874) and Andrew Dickson White's A History of the Warfare of Science with Theology in Christendom (1896). Atheists and agnostics championed the conflict thesis for their own purposes, but historical research gradually demonstrated that Draper and White had propagated more fantasy than fact in their efforts to prove that science and religion are locked in eternal conflict.[9]

Come on man, that's your source? Here, I've got one too. But we here on this sub should know that wikipedia isn't a very good source when trying to separate historical truths from falsehoods anyway.

I'm not lying to you, this topic has been debated for literally thousands of years. Whether you choose to look into it or just continue spouting off falsehoods is up to you though but it isn't true what you said in your other comment.

Come on man, it's a joke. It's the same thing as the flying spaghetti monster. It's an attempt to marginalize the church and point out that christianity is "anti-science". It was first used as a reaction against the church denying evolution and not it's being used to combat "climate denial" and "conspiracy theorism".

look. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Ferrari

I'm not speaking to the validity of the flat earth theory (or lack thereof) as I haven't looked into it enough myself. I was solely disputing your initial comment where you said it was "a theory literally invented by satirists". This just isn't true, period. That's all I took issue with. If you're going to bash something, bash it on its merits instead of making things up about it.

It isn't really comparable at all to the flying spaghetti monster which was created specifically as humor/satire. You can find scientists and philosophers and artists and writers all throughout history who suggested or thought the earth was flat and were totally earnest about it. The idea has existed for millenia.

Also, most "flat earthers" openly state that the flat earth society and its offshoots are disinfo designed to discredit them and their ideas. So pointing these groups out as evidence that the theory is BS doesn't really work, they would agree with you that these groups are full of shit.

There were pre-socratic greek philosophers that talked about a flat earth, but they were talking about a lot of things that weren't meant literally. As of A.D., nobody in science or philosophy was pushing a flat earth idea, and the concept that the church was pushing it was made up by anti-church groups.

Now we're getting into a bit of a pedantic back and forth but there have been philosophers and scientists who have discussed this since 0 AD. Some are mentioned in the wiki article I linked and there are others who aren't listed there. The idea of a "globe earth" (specifically) wasn't widely accepted until a few hundred years ago. Before that, there was much debate - not just of a flat vs. globe earth but literally hundreds of other models and ideas of what the planet and cosmos look like and how they're structured. But regardless, that's all besides the point.

Your first comment said this:

a theory that was literally invented by satirists as a method of mocking "science deniers".

That statement is false. That's what I was pointing out, that and only that. We weren't debating who came up with the theory or when they did, only that they didn't do it as satirists to mock "science deniers". Now whether someone or some group or set of groups has taken this idea and co-opted it or distorted it for their own purposes in the years since? I'm sure, that happens all the time - any idea that can be used by someone will be used by someone. But that wasn't what we were talking about.

I wasn't looking for an argument here so I apologize, I just take issue when I hear something being dismissed based on what I consider false premises. Have a good weekend my friend.

I like you and I can't tell if you're being ambiguosly ironic, but if you're being serious, I think you're drinking antichurch propaganda koolaid.

Think about it. Why were you taught in school that christopher Columbus thought the earth was flat. It's not about keeping a secret. It's about teaching us that modern scientific theories are correct and are up against conservative/ religious ignorance.

I'm not being ambiguous or ironic at all, the simple fact is that this subject has been debated for thousands of years. I don't really know what else to say. No propaganda is involved, you can just read what's been written and see quite clearly that the cosmos and nature of the planet/solar system has always been something that's been heavily debated (it's only within the last few hundred years that a "consensus" has been reached).

I was never told in school that Columbus thought the earth was flat, in fact the entire public school propaganda I was taught said the exact opposite.

It hasn't been debated. Look at your sources: they're trolling. "flat earth societies" are like the church of the subgenius. It's a exercise in philosophy and psychology and argumentation. You aren't meant to take it seriously. This is poe's law at work.

I had a friend call me recently about an article in a local paper from where he was getting married. Had the article been true, it would have impacted his wedding, but the concept was so ridiculous that it could not have been true. I explained to him that this was clearly satire and admonished him for taking it seriously. He clung to the idea that this could not be satire because it wasn't a satirical periodical and we argued about it for way too long. His logic was clouded by the strength of his emotions and it was incredibly frustrating because he is an intelligent person.

As people who are prone to skepticism and questioning authority, we need to be concious and discerning where we give credence. There are studies done all the that try to prove we're susceptible to satire. It's really frustrating when we are.

Tierra Del Fuego's longest day. Calculate where the sun must be seen from on a flat earth model. Make a circle. This is the coverage of the sun. Move that circle over the flat earth winter sun circumference. By your theory, it's light 24/7 365 most of the world.

By "my" theory? What theory? I was simply pointing out the fact that people have been talking about and debating the idea of a flat earth for thousands of years. I said nothing about my own thoughts nor did I make any claims.

So, you are saying the earth isn't flat?

A yes or no is good. I questioned it. I saw an easily provable flaw. I'm pointing it out.

Tierra del Fuego's longest day is 17:19:53. On a flat earth map, the sun's radius of illumination to reach the rise or setting of the sun at TdF would mean it illuminates the world all the time, with minor exceptions.

I agree that calling it false based on consensus is wrong, I agree calling people crazy for questioning it is wrong, but when a theory contradicts a readily, physically, personally observable thing like night and it's been shown to you and yet you persist, you are either a troll or a disinformation agent.

I still haven't said anything about my thoughts on flat earth. Since you're asking so persistently though, no, I don't think the earth is flat but I haven't looked into all of the arguments enough to say I know that for sure.

I didn't address your Tierra del Fuego example because that wasn't the purpose of my comment. I was pointing out that human beings have discussed the idea of a flat earth for thousands of years so the other user's comment that the idea was invented by satirists is just false. No more, no less.

https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/35q9z7/i_am_bill_nye_ceo_of_the_planetary_society_joined/cr6qrfv

Here's a question and answer from Nye's AMA. He hasn't said many things. He implied them. He has not backed up what he has implied, because he doesn't need to, they are just conditional statements.

I'm wary of people who don't state their point of view but imply it without support.

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Then be wary of me, what do I care? It isn't my fault you misunderstood the purpose of my comment and decided to interject and put words in my mouth.

The purpose of your comment is to bring division. I understand. Maybe you should try to.

Haha. Have a good weekend my friend.

You too. I guess I'm misunderstanding why every time I post a very simple invalidation of flat earth, I get down voted but not challenged.

If you aren't among the flat earth crowd, certainly you'd agree this is an odd thing to do.

Yeah that definitely seems odd but all manner of opinions get downvoted around these parts so I wouldn't take the voting too personally. People are very defensive of their beliefs and generally don't like to be challenged. Then add to that the vote and content manipulation that occurs here and people start to think that anyone who doesn't agree with them must have an ulterior motive. Just a guess but that's probably where the downvotes come from. And at any rate, I don't know why you're asking me personally since I have no way of determining who votes or why they do so.

No, there is no reason to waste our time talking about how the Earth is flat. That is not a theory that is a mental delusion.

I'm always curious to learn about new things, even if they don't make any sense

If it doesn't make sense then what new things are you learning?

If multiple people have the same theory (and/or mental illness), doesn't that fact alone add reason to discuss it?

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." -Aristotle

I wonder what Aristotle would say about this topic considering how resoundly a non-flat Earth has been proven.

The official story of 9/11 has also been "resoundly proven".

Sail around the fucking earth

/r/LimitedHangouts

Look. There are some things you can have a sensible discussion about and there are things that make no sense.

Believing the Earth is flat just shows how ignorant you can become.

There is one thing to say the Moon Landing never happened and quite another to say that the Moon doesn't exist.

I understand where you are coming from. The scope of the lie required for the official version of the earth to be untrue is so huge. It is too far off of your world view to be even valid for consideration.

But, do you hold any current opinions that in the past you would have dismissed without investigation? A couple of years ago I would have had the same reaction to many, many topics, not just the shape of the earth. Psychology is a strange thing.

the people who claim they 'question everything' including the earth being round and the existence of nukes and so on always fail to question their own intelligence and maturity.

some things are just absolutely pointless to question. like if water is truly wet, or if ice is really cold. the lies are everywhere! dun dun dun! given all the other silly 'skepticism' for other topics i'm surprised IF these haven't been brought to the table of 'serious discussion' by 'well meaning' free thinkers. In the end, all it does is make people who question events of significance get lumped in the same camp according to the rest of the public.

Who gets to decide what topics are valid for consideration? What is the appropriate methodology for making these decisions? To allow this to be dictated by some authority or punishment by the herd is problematic.

people get to decide. it's common sense. the methodology is logical reasoning, which people who want to stick to flat earth this and no nukes that never bother to use, indistinguishable from troll behavior.

You're actually going to argue it's worth discussing whether water is wet? it is only problematic for people who want to split such hairs and pick flyshit out of pepper over such trivial bullshit that has been settled for hundreds of years. when it comes to major events that don't add up and a lot of sweeping policy changes, that's when it matters. duh.

You're actually going to argue it's worth discussing whether water is wet?

The wetness of water or thinking proves the thinker are completely different types of topics.

For the shape of the earth I am talking about physical, measurable properties. It's not a philosophical debate.

I have flown around in planes. I've seen the Earth from up above. There is 0% chance that the Earth is flat. I've also been at sea where you see the horizon. I've changed my mind about stuff, but some things are just true because they are true.

For example, water boils at 100 degrees Celsius. There is absolutely nothing that will change my mind on this. (I know physics and I know boiling point depends on a lot of factors. I'm using this as an example. )

I have flown around in planes. I've seen the Earth from up above. There is 0% chance that the Earth is flat. I've also been at sea where you see the horizon.

Yes, I have done these things too. There are some observations you should make the next time you are in a plane or have the opportunity to see a ship sail away from you.

but some things are just true because they are true

There is an enormous amount of evidence to consider on this topic. By saying something is true because it is true you deny yourself the opportunity to think through it yourself.

Think of it as an exercise in logic and reasoning. You don't have to go into it looking to have your mind changed. Many thinking people go into the topic looking to debunk it, but end up realizing there is something to it.

This is an intro written by another user if you are interested:

https://np.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/3cowhi/intro_to_flat_earth_a_basic_primer_v20/

A caution on this topic, there is a huge amount of disinfo on it. The Flat Earth Society is clearly freemason run controlled opposition. They exist to dead end people on the topic and forget about it by making silly arguments such as the earth is rising at 9.8 m/s² in order to create the effect of gravity. Many debunk videos on the subject then refute these straw man arguments (ex https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNqNnUJVcVs). It is easy to win a debate when you get to attribute whatever statements you like to your opponent.

This discussion is hopeless.

You can't have an opinion on anything if you don't have at least some things that are true because they are true.

Are you going to tell me now that "Cogito, ergo sum." is not actually true?

Why should the shape of the earth be a base, unquestionable truth? Who gets to decide that? There is a wealth of evidence on this topic, why not look at that instead?

Because nobody gives a flying fuck if we live on a round Earth or a flat Earth. Everybody cares about living. I want to live in a world where my government tries to help me and not try to kill me.

For sure. In and of itself, the shape of the earth isn't all that important. I didn't really want to get into it in this thread, but another user brought it up. To me, the importance of it lies in demonstrating the magnitude of the deceptions we are under. It is a subject where physical measurements and observations can be made to demonstrate the lie, trusting documents or what someone else says is not required.

I have to agree here. The fact that the earth is round is not an axiom, it's a theory. So far it has overwhelming evidence supporting it and likely it is the truth. However something along the lines of "the earth is a projection of a four dimensional object / is some plane and space is warped around it" could come up. Almost infinitesimally likely but possible.

Axioms have the be taken from base logic, not something that you can gather evidence for. That is not the correct use of the scientific method.

take your own advice: https://youtu.be/_YzeGRFDIms

It's even in a youtube video! I hear conspiracy theorists like youtube videos!

The Flat Earth Society is clearly freemason run controlled opposition.

hahahahahahahahaha

Why is that funny?

You are an excellent troll! Thx for entertaining me :)

I assure you I'm not trolling.

The intro has been deleted?

It looks that way. It was posted by /u/high-priest-of-slack That account hasn't been active in almost a month. The intro and all his comments on that thread have been deleted, but his other posts are still visible.

Here's another version of it.

Here's another version of it.

Thanks

Constants in science are only absolute until they are disproven, which history shows happens often. Just saying..

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here.

Think about history. We use to believe the Earth was flat. That was 100% fact at the time. It was an absolute constant. Then Aristotle and the like came along and said nah it's actually round. They were at the time met with extreme ridicule from people just like you; who said things like, "this is dangerous thinking, blah blah" and as such the truth was suppressed for hundreds of years.

Who's to say we got it right now?

The mountains of evidence we have. In science, when things get overturned it is with new evidence.

The flat earth theory has been dismissed since Aristotle (Pythagoras originally did the calculations) accepted the Earth was round and espoused that...2300 years ago. The heliocentric model was first dismissed by Church leadership because, surprise, they felt it would undermine their hold on power.

The scientific community, at large, will listen to any credible theory and check it out. It's just that certain things (such as a round Earth) are proven (due to the fact that you can sail around the world) and it becomes impossible to disprove them.

This never happened. Nobody believed the Earth was flat. Check your sources better.

Also how does flat Earth explain the Coriolis effect? Also how do they explain that if you look at a Sunrise over the sea while being on a hill and then running down that the hill and you see the Sunrise again?

Dude I'm not advocating for the Flat Earth theory, I know little about it. I'm talking about the basic fundamentals of free thinking.

Also, nobody ever believed the Earth was flat? The fuck are you talking about?

Nobody believed the Earth was flat.

False. Check your sources better. There was heated debate about the nature of the planet and cosmos for thousands of years with literally hundreds of different theories and explanations given and argued over. There was no "consensus" on any of it. So while it's false to say that all people believed the earth was flat, it's equally false to say that all people believed the earth was round. The truth is that both were considered and debated and neither was ever proven conclusively.

That's just ignorant.

Even if that was actually the sequence of events, the earth has been proven scientifically and mathematically beyond any reasonable doubt to be round. That fact doesn't change.

As someone else mentioned before. The chance that the earth is flat is literally 0%. That is a set-in-stone fact.

Try again.

Did you notice the immediately start talking about the most way out thing on the sub. It's what they do along with the Bozos who claim we don't post proof when we do the just reject it but offer no proof on their side. You're post is apparently the mating call of the North American Shill, they're out this time of season.

I personally enjoy watching flat earth videos. I enjoy any conspiracy that is instantly dismissed, but also has passionate believers who are at least attempting to put their evidence forward.

Why does a flat earth need to be discussed?

Do you discuss whether or not the delusions of a schizophrenic are real?

Actually yes, here is a lecture about why we should from the teacher Alan Watts:

http://youtu.be/cuX8sKr1Sa4

There's an alien peddling a bicycle at the centre of the earth, which makes the earth spin.

Let's discuss it.

If you disagree or downvote me, your a paid shill or a troll.

Hey don't bring him into this

Even if he's a flat earther, which I disagree with along with many of the views in this sub, it's something that should be discussed, not just downvoted and called crazy

I think 2+2 = 5. Discuss.

I would call myself an earth shape agnostic. After having spent a good deal of time on the subject I can't say that I know of a complete working model. Both the official spinning globe model and the standard flat earth model have problems. But all it takes to make it an important topic of conversation is to show that the official version is incorrect. I would call this similar to 9/11 in that way. I don't absolutely know what occurred there, but I do know that the official version cannot be true so it is an important thing to discuss.

Feel free to check out my post history if you are interested in the things I've said.

it is not at all similar to 9/11.

What I am trying to say is that it is not necessary to have a complete alternate explanation for 9/11 in order to make it an important topic of conversation. All you have to do is show that the official story cannot be correct.

Similarly for the shape of the earth it is not necessary to present a complete alternate model. All that is required is to show that the official spinning globe model has unresolvable contradictions.

I just want a flat earther to provide an accurate explaination of the pysical world using math, physics does that based on the assumption that the world is round. Where is the flat earth rebuttle? If you cannot provide logical math related arguments that disprove physics or prove a new way of thinking about the physical world then what proof do you have?

As I have stated several times, I don't know of a full working model that I can endorse. But that is not required to make this a valid topic of conversation. All that is necessary is to show that the official spinning globe model cannot work. For example, showing that water does not curve. For a globe of circumference 25000 miles there should be drop from the tangent of 8 inches * distance in miles^2, but this doesn't happen.

I encourage you to look into the topic for yourself, there is a huge amount of information there. But I don't have any vested interest in convincing you of anything.

But water does curve... you just refuse to beleive that it does, watch a ship sailing away into the horizon. What is the last part that you can see? Oh right, the masts or highest point. The rest of the ship hasn't sunk, it has just dropped below our line of sight. That's how I can tell that the world is round. All this masturbating about an 8in drop is just disrupting you from seeing the world as it is, round...

But water does curve... you just refuse to beleive that it does

That really isn't the case. It's not about a 'belief'. People associate beliefs with their identity and so are resistant to changing them when presentated with evidence to the contrary. I try as much as possible to hold "opinions based on the evidence that I have seen" so that I am able to constantly reconsider what I "know".

I don't really want to get deep into this topic in this thread, it's rehashing things I have been through many times before, ie the ship going down over the horizon is one of the first things that gets discussed. If you are interested, look into the topic for yourself. I have no need to convince you of anything.

Wait, can you tell me what happens to the bottom of a ship once it disappears over the horizon? Seems pretty simple to me. If the world was flat, the bottom of the ship would have to sink, is that not what happens?

I really don't care if you answer the question, I just think it funny watching you dance around all the observable phenomenon that shows that the earth is round with no explainations. Heck, explain gravity, the coriolous effect, night and day cycles, or eclipses these are all things that have an explanation in the spherical world theory that can be used to successfully calculate when and where these phenomenon will occur. Can flat earth say the same? As others have pointed out, flat earth theory has been around for far longer than the spherical earth and yet, Noone can provide me with an explanation for how any of these thing happen in accordance with the planar earth.

Water doesn't curve? wtf? it's liquid. It has currents that go all sorts of directions. Each drop of water is held onto the earth at it's location by gravity, which is at the center of the earth, so wherever the water is on the surface, it will fall towards the center, making it very easy for water to stay on the surface no matter where it is at on a sphere. Gravity is not below the earth. Learn some basic physics. Or is all of physics a conspiracy too?

"I encourage you to look into the topic for yourself, there is a huge amount of information there" again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YzeGRFDIms

Falsifying the 9/11 official story is fine. because it's loaded with bullshit. Falsifying the globe theory is also fine, but it has never been falsified. The 'unresolvable contradictions' of which you speak of have already been explained, thousands of times over. Your misunderstandings and inability to understand the explanations is not the problem with the theory, that is your problem.

I think we should just end the discussion at this point. You are clearly assuming that all contradictions must have been resolved because you know the earth is a globe. You don't even know what contradictions I am speaking of. This isn't the topic of the thread, so I don't really want to dive into it. If you are interested, you should look for yourself. Just know what it means if you dismiss without looking.

I already have looked for myself. The flat earth theory doesn't rely upon anything besides complete misunderstandings and silly questions that have been debunked and answered over and over and over. Or do you have some secret stash of contradictions I have never seen before? You don't even know what i've looked at. But that's ok, you can save both of us time by bailing on the point you brought up.

You're right, I don't know what you have looked at.

I will watch the video you linked later. I am absolutely open to new evidence. It is important to realize on this topic that there are not just two answers to choose between though. Disproving the standard flat earth model is not the same as proving the globe.

Your statements on water don't really say much. Like "It has currents that go all sorts of directions". Obviously water can flow. I'm talking about measuring over long distances and not finding curvature.

I am aware of false dichotomies. maybe the earth isn't a flat plane, but could be a cube, dodecahedron, etc? Too bad there is no evidence of anything besides what points to a globe. If you were brought to outer space to see earth for yourself, you'd still come up with some stupid bullshit to say, 'well, that doesn't really prove it, i could be in a matrix and my visual cortex is being fed false information'. Pointless splitting of hairs. You're in denial.

your statements on water don't really say anything to begin with since water is probably one of the best substances we know of that produces curvature, wherever it is. I don't know what measurements you're talking about, but they're totally incompetent if they can't find curvature. You might as well say "i'm talking about measurements done thousands of times to ping www.google.com and not getting any replies".

This should help with conceptualizing the flat earth. This model works perfectly.

https://youtu.be/lPuedDwAeKc https://youtu.be/wqKTLzUKqDc https://youtu.be/d6BY15hwVzo

The earth is flat, I have spent an inordinate amount of the last 4 months on this and it is flat, I would bet my life on it.

Not to toot my own horn but I am not a moron that doesn't understand science etc. , I have been IQ tested and am borderline genius, and was in honors classes throughout my schooling.

I would pay thousands of dollars to see you sat down infront of an astrophysicist

I have been IQ tested and am borderline genius, and was in honors classes throughout my schooling

M'humblebrag

I'd hate to see what he says when he isn't being humble.

it works perfectly, sure, except for all of these basic problems: https://youtu.be/_YzeGRFDIms

if you'll bet your life on it then lets see you go find the edge of this flat earth and report back. no? oh that's right, didn't think so.

I could give two fucks about the edge. There are hundreds of other proofs without needing to see the edge. I want you all to wake up to this and then collectively we can boot governments and taxes out of our lives once and for all.

there aren't even 3 proofs let alone hundreds.

lol ok. As I said, didn't think so. Ever tried to reverse your logic? what if we were already taught the world is flat, it was believed around the world...and all the pictures and video of the edges were just cgi? and then the populous tells you to give evidence of a round earth and you just say 'i could give two fucks about pictures of it being round'.

love how you people are impervious to basic logic that goes both ways. you just want it your way, to feed that desperate ego of esotericism.

also, i do not see how in any way proving what the shape of the earth is has any bearing on governments and taxes. we could be living on the inside of a dodecahedron, governments and taxes will still have their bearing on our lives. so much for that borderline genius you were tooting your own horn about, after you said 'not to toot my own horn'.

If the Earth is flat why are the masts of ships visible before the hull?

If the Earth is flat why is it that the sun is closer to the horizon at "higher" altitudes?

If the Earth is flat does that mean that the other planets are flat too?

If the other planets are spherical and ours is flat, how did ours become flat?

If the others are spherical and ours is flat why doens't their atmosphere just drop to the bottom of the universe?

Does Earth's gravity extend beyond our flat Earth?

Is gravity a property of a local body or is it universal?

Does the universe have a bottom?

Why do jets fly in arcs rather than straight lines?

Why does water go down drains counter clock-wise in the Northern hemisphere and clock-wise in the Southern hemisphere?

If the Earth is flat why do near-space photographs show curvature?

When confronted with the big questions, he doesn't respond.

Typical, isn't it?

Typical of any /r/conspiracy user, really.

Never debate a flat-Earther.

Instead ask questions you know will undermine him with any reply he may offer.

4 months! 4 whole months! next up its tenure

The map proposed in the first video has some pretty easy flaws just in the world of geometry...unless physical space and travel through it is an illusion.

Just saying there are flaws does not make it so can you please be more specific?

In the proposed map, earth is analogous to a pizza. So as you go closer to the crust (ice wall) travel times around the pizza get longer.

On the real planet earth this isn't true. Travelling due west around the world from 45 degrees north (roughly NYC) gives you a longer flight time than travelling due west from 60 degrees south which would be the southern tip of South America. The proposed map would do the opposite.

People who boast about their I.Q. are losers.

Stephen Hawking

Are you quoting that tard? I'm not comfortable stating that bit about me the main issue is intelligence is attacked first so I just put it out there like it's not that I'm a mouth breather.

Steven Hawking believes in "black holes."

Which are mathematically impossible.

You don't divide anything by zero. That's just idiotic. And yet that how they justify black holes. By using bullshit math that any eighth grade would know is wrong.

lol. I love the internet. Full of people who boast about their IQs and literally think they know more than world famous scientists.

there is no dividing by zero with black holes. this is literally based on a joke from first year physics.

hold on... is this serious? Does anyone know if this guy is serious?

Do you really think that they... you can't actua-.. do you really think.. Are you fucking serious?

I'm fully aware that you'll neither read nor understand the following:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deriving_the_Schwarzschild_solution

The [R] is zero.

Dividing by zero is impossible.

I'm also aware that you likely went to a public school and will not hold it against you.

Neither Stephen Hawking nor any other logical human being believes that black holes are explained by the division of zero. Everybody knows that dividing by zero isn't possible. That whole idea is a joke. Do you not understand this? Literally everybody knows that you can't divide by zero, you're the first person I've ever met that thinks people are serious when they say that. It's literally an Internet meme

The R in that equation is the radius of the event horizon. Not the radius of the singularity.

The schwarzschild radius of an object is the region within which you'd need to go faster than the speed of light to escape the gravitational pull. Since it is impossible to accelerate up to the speed of light this is impossible, so anything within the schwarzschild radius can never escape (bar some quantum mechanical tricks). A defining characteristic of a black hole is that it is smaller than its own schwarzschild radius, that's why they're called black holes in the first place.

Black holes are possible mate, there's one in your head where your brain should be.

Thanks, I will check out those videos. I have spent a lot of time on it in the last few months as well.

I think it is important to distinguish between disproving the official spinning globe model and proving any other model complete. A single proof by contradiction can get rid of the globe, but proving another model completely correct means addressing contradictions raised with the new model.

For example, in the standard flat earth model, how do long summer days work in the Southern 'hemisphere'?

Not to toot my own horn but I am not a moron that doesn't understand science etc. , I have been IQ tested and am borderline genius, and was in honors classes throughout my schooling.

That part really wasn't necessary. I'm sure you know statements like that can't be verified and border on appeal to authority.

Just starting to get into this one myself... I can't believe I'm entertaining the theory, but the more I try and argue it the harder it gets.

I do have a couple of questions about it though - certain things that stop me from entirely buying into it... Let me know if you have any thoughts...

One is the sun. I get how perspective will make it seem like it is "setting" as it rotates off into the distance, but it just seems like there would be some kind of residual glow from the sun after it has "set".

Then there is the matter of gravity. Because of centrifugal force (or centripetal force if you prefer), and also because of varying altitudes in various parts of the planet, the net effect of gravity on solid objects is not constant, so objects weigh different amounts on different parts of the globe. I know this is the theory, but it would not be hard to verify this with experiments, so I would imagine that someone has done so (I haven't found an experiment yet, but I need to look harder). If the results are as expected, this would kinda debunk the flat earth model... although the opposite is also true.

The other thing is that amateur astronomers have apparently taken pictures of satellites... a quick google search can confirm this. They could be lying. Or could there be another explanation?

There is a residual glow of the celestial sphere above, you will never be outside in pitch black. There is always a faint glow.

Gravity is not two objects attracting one another like they say but it is a force at 9.8meters per second downward.

These pictures are very easy to shop until I see a RAW image of the file. I'm guessing too that there may be some flying objects that can stay up there a long time but what goes up must come down.

There is no space or a vacuum up there. Just think about vacuum coffee just one pierce and the vacuum escapes yet our rockets and spaceships pass through this barrier with no problem.

Physics is not strong with this one. Do you or don't you beleive in Newtonian physics? You can't have it both ways man... where is that downward force coming from? Is god pressing down on the earth with his thumb?

There is no space or a vacuum up there. Just think about vacuum coffee just one pierce and the vacuum escapes yet our rockets and spaceships pass through this barrier with no problem.

You need to think relatively. The atmosphere thins as we go higher, so there isn't a distinct barrier between atmosphere and the vacuum of space. It's just less pressure...less pressure...less pressure...less pressure...mostly a vacuum.

I'd be interested in how you came to your conclusion. I haven't taken a full stance on any conspiracy yet presented to me, because both sides have way too much conflicting ideas. I do take a full stance on the fact conspiracies are being played against us all, at almost all times.

It started last year when I noticed my east to west and west to east flights were neither aided nor hindered by the earth's supposed rotation. In fact i was getting from west to east sooner in some cases. The horizon always stayed the same place no matter how high the plane goes and flat. I shrugged it off and did not think too deep, just an anomaly I thought. Then 4+ months ago it was posted here about flat earth. I quickly jumped on some research to quickly debunk and move on to more "important" conspiracies. I then found myself absolutely convinced after a solid month of research of anywhere between 2-6 hours a day of research. I now know this is the ONLY conspiracy we can prove and rid ourselves of all of the others by dismantling the government that has made us stupid, egoic, materialistic, small etc.. Government is enemy number one and this is the ticket to freedom the hardest part is sharing this with others because you aren't really convincing them they need to be willing to admit they were wrong horribly lied to and duped. Not everyone is ready for the true matrix unplugging.

I just wanted to point out the planes movement and the earths rotation are locked together, when a plane leaves the ground and is in the earths atmosphere it doesn't move faster one way or the other due to the rotation. If you were to have that plane hover in place above a specific location on its on accord, it would stay with the earth as it rotates. Or else you could just fly a hot air balloon up (minus any wind of course) wait a hour or so and come back down and be thosands of miles away due to quickness of rotation. We know this isn't the case though. Picture a plane flying on earth as a insect flying in a car. The whole planet is moving, with the plane in the sky, add the energy spent to move against all external forces (jets) and we're flying.

Not being an ass or disagreeing with you, just dropping how I picture it

This is a major flaw because if you want to say everything just stays connected then you would need to have the opposite force headed against the spin which we don't see either.

This is the problem I have with the Flat earth theory. Most advocates of it don't have a proper understanding of physics, which leads to them only debating points which have been proven wrong thousands of times.

, I have been IQ tested and am borderline genius,

I have been iq tested as well. I am apparently a genius. And i dont believe in a flat earth...

O_o

FortHouston and BillionaireBob suck.

Agreed.

How do we know that they aren't correct and that you're not a shill.

Critical reasoning skills.

High quality response. Have an upvote for taking the time to smooth that out for me.

I personally think they are doing a service to this community. Number 1, I don't think every single one of them are shills. A few of them appear to be legitimate devil's advocates, keeping us on our toes. 2, even if they are shills, we have to work harder to make our points convincing, meaning they are forcing us to read more (at least this applies to me). I can test out arguments and claims here to see what they say, refine the argument after a few more tries, then I throw the argument out to the greater Reddit community. 3, when your argument is strong enough, they stop responding. They just ignore you and downvote, meaning you've probably passed a satisfactory-level of truth. You should strive for no less.

I second this observation. They have both exceeded their maximum allotment of douchiness.

I just call him Bob. In fact, call both of em Bob.

E're day. Call them out and move on. Don't waste your time with worthless, low IQ disruptors.

A flat earther ranting about shills. This fucking subreddit

I disagree with you about flat earth, so I'm a shill? Kiss my ass. I ask for sources when people make claims, so I'm a shill? Kiss my ass. I require evidence over speculation when forming my opinions, so im a shill? Kiss my ass. I don't believe in every fucking conspiracy theory posted here, so Im a shill? Kiss my ass.

@ me next time.

No, I never said that. I'm not talking about you disagreeing with me on any particular topic. I base my statement on your post history in general.

I will not be kissing your ass.

I don't blindly follow whatever people post here, so I'm a shill? Since when did requiring evidence to believe something become shill behavior? Y'all like to say whoever doesn't question the official narrative is just a sheep. So that means I should just blindly follow what some dude writes in a blog post? Gtfo

I don't think I ever used the s word.

Grow up. It's obvious what you're trying to say without saying it.

I'll be here longer than you and I'll continue to make sure there is evidence behind anything I believe in. YOU are the sheep if you allow your opinions to be swayed by a random person posting whatever they want here.

Edit: I'll just leave this comment here, one that you apparently liked a lot:

"Here is a better rule of thumb: to read or listen to an opinion that I know ahead of time I might disagree with, and to make up my own mind as to the veracity of the speaker or writer after carefully evaluating their statements based on evidence."

That word implies motivation. I don't know why you do what you do.

What are you trying to say I do?

What I try and do is have strong evidence behind my beliefs.

I will let your post history speak for itself.

You're trying to drag my name through the mud because you have a personal vendetta. It's bullshit.

[deleted]

How? By requiring evidence to exist before I'll believe/support something. I can live with that. I don't censor anyone. I ask people to support what they believe. If you can't that's on you.

If you'll blindly follow anyone who opposes the mainstream just because they oppose it you're just as blind as those who never question the mainstream.

You're not fooling anyone, Mr. 8 hour days of "conspiracies don't exist."

Drag your name through the mud..? LOL.

Never said anything about conspiracies not eisting. You just seem to believe every single thing posted here, regardless of where the information comes from. I've said it many, many, many times. I require evidence for me to believe something. I want facts to back up anything I support.

If you blindly follow anything, regardless of what side it supports, you're a sheep. It is what it is.

You, of all people, calling me a sheep. That's rich.

If you blindly follow anything you are.

Said it before.

1. We have trolls.

2. People post nonsense now.

3. People are accused of being a shill if they don't agree with you.

4. People don't do their own research.

This sub is not anything like it used to be. Which is why I frequent less and less.

Good.

Hopefully, it indicates a growing awareness that Youtube videos are not "proof", and that non-mainstream sources are every bit as biased and inaccurate as mainstream ones.

The more we question EVERYTHING - and that includes the claims made here with little or no evidence - the closer we can get to the truth.

I think we need to all do our part and spread the love. If there's a comment you read that you like or strongly agree with, upvote it. Don't just click through someone's hard work and forget to give it credit. Your upvote helps the information spread to other people.

Same goes for downvoting, but I think we are all pro at that lol.

I disagree completely, the only revolution that can ultimately succeed is a non violent one. Violence and hate always breed more of the same - violence and hate - which is exactly what those in power want, they want us to be angry, violent and full of hatred . A corrupt and divided population is easier to rule than a moral, ethical and united population. Remember that peace and love don't mean passivity, any action stemming from peace has much greater power than action that stems from anger or hate - I have experienced that countless times in my own life.

And if you want an example of a peaceful revolution, think Gandhi - he drove out the British in pretty much the most peaceful way possible.

I think the mods are slipping. Some are modding this sub and conspiracy on voat. I am seeing alot of rule breaking not addressed.

Rule breaking needs to be reported to be addressed. I reported some rule breaking a couple weeks ago and the mods were quick to take action. You can't expect them to read every comment of every post. Use the report button.

That's good but they are not consistent. To be honest, I don't know how to judge rule 10, the rule is not clear. I rarely get anything back from mods after reporting so how do I know if it is or not.

I'm not a mod. The list is on the side. They are here. Several participate regularly in discussion.

yes i often ask myself why i dont spent all day in /r/christianity calling them all whack job delusional crazys and encouraging them to seek help. also why i dont educate /r/cats on why dogs are so much better.

They actually do, go on /r/religion; it is full of trolls from /r/atheism specifically.

Disagreeing does not equal trolling.

It does to certain people (e.g. feminists)...

I'm also confused and intrigued on a weekly basis by this sub. These are muddy waters. On one hand, people here "believe" A LOT OF SHIT on the word of "experts" outside the "mainstream" they blast. On the other hand, "proof" is needed for them to make a perceived leap to believing that extraterrestrials exist AT ALL because of things like Project Blue Beam.

There are a lot of closed minds in this sub wearing the masks of critical thinkers, rationalizing their own disbelief as skepticism. Don't hate them for it. Disinfo campaigns are successful nearly all the time.

It's a discussion forum, not an echo chamber. Not everybody supports every conspiracy.

For example, the only conspiracies that I believe/am interested in are cryptids and cryptid coverups. Of course nobody talks about that here. We have jews, police brutality, 9/11, and occasional circlejerking. None of which I care to discuss or believe all that much. (Well, police brutality I guess, but that's hardly a conspiracy.)

Oh cryptids. I used to be a big fan of cryptids. The more I read though, the more disheartened I get. It doesn't help that all the mainstream TV "documentaries" that seem to have the best evidence and experts are 99% fictional.

Yeah, the Learning Channel and Discovery Channel really ruined the scene. It's a shame.

90% of crypids have about a 0% chance of actually existing, but it's still fun to discuss. That other 10% is what keeps me geniunely interested in it all. There's plenty of mysteries left in the world.

For the off chance that a cryptid thread might show up. Plus I'll hop into a discussion once in awhile anyways.

Also there's always tons of arguing in here and it's fun to read.

Why are you so afraid of differing opinions? Why do you want me to leave? Am I not allowed to express my ideas?

I do so in a respectful manner and I don't come here with the specific intent of disagreeing.

You literally told me to go to a different subreddit.

I don't come here for bigfoot as I think it's a bullshit topic and it isn't often covered here.

I'm sure people think the same about flat earthers. They have their own subreddit too. Why aren't you telling them to go to to /r/theworldisflat ?

If there were a sub called /r/cryptatards that downvoted everything anyone said about Bigfoot or chupacabra or whatever and said everyone who is interested in that stuff is crazy and needs psychological help, would you not be insulted and frustrated?

Not particularly. It's the internet and I don't get all that phased by random strangers talking smack. That and I understand that few actually believe in cryptids. Conspiracy theorists are very much a minority that holds fringe views. You have every right to have those views but it's completely understandable why other people might mock them. Things like "We didn't go to the moon" or "the Earth is flat" are things that are laughed at. That's something people need to accept and subsequently brush off.

Besides all that, like I mentioned I'm not just here for cryptids. I enjoy discussing and debating conspiracies regardless of whether or not I believe them. Kills time at work at the very least.

Additionally I've been in the military for about four years now so I like giving my perspective on things like America's militarized police and such along with clearing up any misconceptions about my branch.

lol okay.

Reddit administrators sent a bunch of shitlords here. We capped 300k subscriptions only recently and we've gained 20k since then.

I've been here at least 3 years. This is not bad. It has been way worse. We will always have some shills and trolls.

I know what you mean. Instead of having discussion with others i find myself arguing with trolls :-[ anit seems like they are getting worse and worse everytime. All the interesting posts that should be on top are being downvoted by people who don't even want anything ro do with this subreddit in the first place.

Whenever its nightime in Tel Aviv it feels like there are less shills on the prowl.

just got downvoted because its only 9:28 pm in Tel Aviv. If I waited until after bedtime, my post would have remained untouched.

I didn't know 'they' slept.

It depends if they havested enough palestinian blood that day. I heard they prefer children.

They're like locust. Every so often they swarm through here. No worry, they'll disappear like a fart in the breeze.

Because the conspiracies this place promotes have gone down the toilet. It use to be rational, and believable. Now every second post is about contrails, vaccines or aliens.

I find just the opposite. There is a mainline viewpoint on /r/conspiracy and on major threads if you go against it you will be very heavily downvoted. Even simply innocuous statements that would generally be ignored or upvoted on the major subs. Examples of things that will be downvoted include (but are in no way limited to) the following:

• The cause of the Twin Towers falling was because two hijacked jet airlines flew into them
• Adam Lanza was a mentally disturbed individual who murdered 26 people in Sandy Hook Elementary School
• If there are paid shills on this sub, they are highly ineffective
• Around 11 million people were purposely murdered by the Nazis during WWII in an event known as the Holocaust. 6 million of them were Jews.
• ISIS is a loosely connected series of individual groups that came out of hard-liner civilians who opposed various Mid-East regimes and have little to no outside support other than what they take or get as ransom
• Dzhokhar Tsarnaev and his brother Tamerlyn set off bombs in Boston that killed three people and injured many more. Their purpose was classic terrorism: to terrify a civilian population.
• /r/worldnews is heavily moderated and many things on many different topics get deleted from there on a daily basis. There's no inherent political bias to what stays and what goes.

And on and on and on.

EDIT: I believe I've just confirmed my own point. Here is a comment listing the things that get downvoted here, getting downvoted. As usual, instead of people discussing the points they simply downvote. If they do comment, they latch on to one specific thing and simply call it "wrong" as if no discussion is necessary, it's a simple solved matter.

/r/worldnews is heavily moderated and many things on many different topics get deleted from there on a daily basis. There's no inherent political bias to what stays and what goes.

COMPLETE BULLSHIT ALERT ....

/r/worldnews is one of the most rabidly pro-Israel subs on reddit.com. The moderators in that sub will delete any/all posts critical of Israel/Zionism/Jews without exception. If your comment manages to survive moderators deleting it, then it is instantly downvoted into -40+ within minutes.

It should be noted that /u/Yserbuis is also a moderator of /r/Israel

These are the top posts on /r/worldnews from the past seven days. Out of the top ten, only three can be seen as "pro-Israel" while several are very anti-Israel. Perhaps you can explain to me how this fits with your narrative. Preferably soon, as I see your accounts a month old which is near your personal expiration date.

While not required, you are requested to use the NP domain of reddit when crossposting. This helps to protect both your account, and the accounts of other users, from administrative shadowbans. The NP domain can be accessed by prefacing your reddit link with np.reddit.com.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

Lmao. World News pro Israel? Give me a fucking break. Either show me some proof or shut the fuck up please. A post about illegally planted olive trees being removed got upwards of 5k upvotes. A report detailing atrocities Hamas conducted on its own people as well as putting civilians in harms way during the conflict couldn't break 200. Clearly its pro Israel. Rofl.

Gee I wonder why there is such a disparity in the death tolls. Hmmm... what could it possibly be?

Question. Who initiates the fighting? Who has started the wars?

Well whenever I've encountered people dogmatically subscribing to such things despite a plethora of presented evidence that suggests otherwise, I will admit after the 4th or 5th explicit denial I start getting jumpy with my downvotes.

But, my first response typically would elaborate on evidence demonstrating such statements to be demonstrably false.

Such as:

Residues of thermite found at the twin towers, squibs ejecting frak from windows in WTC 1, 2, and 7. Dozens of eyewitness accounts of bombs. Admissions that WTC7 was pulled. Evidence of beams cut and bent in ways that demonstrate heats in excess of jet-fueled office fires. The fireballs that would have burnt off most of the remaining jet fuel.

-The lack of evidence that anything ever happened at the abandoned school in Sandy Hook. Professional public testimony that LEOs obstructed independent investigation.(hey 9/11 all over again!)

-evidence that paid shills exist and post on this sub(can't argue that they're ineffective unless their only use is social monitoring)

-historical records demonstrating the inflation of the Nazi's atrocities starting BEFORE WWII. The lack of a single gas chamber having been found. The time it takes to incinerate a body vs. the numbers allegedly incinerated.

-evidence that the US armed salafist extremists to fight the democratically elected government of Assad. ISIS is salafist, ftr.

-how do law enforcement stop an informant from testifying, give him a thracheotomy! The Tsarnaevs were working with intelligence agencies. I don't even think they dropped the one bomb. It went off meters from where he supposedly placed it. Another case of shitty media exposure, all fear mongering, no solid investigative journalism, except reddit, who was asking the right questions like why was academi on sight and why was there a concurrent bombdrill? But it was definitely staged to inspire fear. No doubt about that.

-world news IS heavily moderated and the biases (plural!) appear obvious: pro-israel, pro-corporate, pro-war, prostate, pro-consumption, pro-police, etc..

People discuss things a great deal here than they do elsewhere. Unfortunately.

I'm not going to argue those points over here, that wasn't the purpose of my thread. The point I'm trying to bring is that there is a very clearly defined /r/conspiracy dogma. The comments I made are typical comments that go against the dogma and instead of generating discussion or whatever are heavily downvoted and the user is lambasted as a "shill" or what have you.

For a community that's supposed to be about discussing taboo subjects and fighting for free speech, this is not the correct behavior.

EDIT: Oooh! and thanks for breaching another /r/conspiracy verboten topic. Assad. Any criticism of Assad over here is ridiculed and downvoted.

I don't see any comments being removed, users banned or shadow banned for "verboten" /r/conspiracy topics.

I do see plenty of sheep and shills parroting MSM propaganda like diligent disinformation lackeys. And I'll go so far as to say they receive more humane treatment her me than conspiracy theorists receive on any front page subreddit.

Also, none of those topics you've mentioned are taboo. They're all mainstream opinions pumped by the corporate propaganda machine. Yet even here, we tolerate them and do our best to pursue the truth of such matters.

I'll bet Assad was as corrupt as Gaddafi. Probably some kind of Muslim progressive.

Their forbidden in the sense that mentioned that you hold those opinions is the same as saying "give me all your downvotes". That's not how an open community is supposed to be. There is no tolerance here for differing opinions. Period.

Actually the entire premise of this subreddit is to offer a place that tolerates different opinions. So. You're wrong.

Receiving negative imaginary internet points is not tantamount to being censored. We tolerate shills and sheep just fine. Hell, I encourage sheep to come here to ask questions and educate themselves.

It's only when you hold onto these views despite the plethora of information compiled and offered by this community that would make any honest person change their minds, then do we downvote dogmatic ignorance.

But we never (to my knowledge) remove comments or users that promote ignorance. Perhaps we should.

Actually the entire premise of this subreddit is to offer a place that tolerates different opinions. So. You're wrong.

It's fine that the moderators tolerate differing opinions, but it's highly hypocritical that users complain about lack of tolerance in other subreddits downvote anything they don't like over here.

But we never (to my knowledge) remove comments or users that promote ignorance. Perhaps we should.

So you believe in censorship? That a small minority has a right to decide what can and cannot be said? That anything they don't like they can mark with black marker?

Welcome to reddit. Where tolerance is championed yet dissidence is down voted. We could just remove downvotes altogether. After all, a negative opinion is an invalid opinion, right?

We don't remove dissenting comments. We don't ban dissenting users. We don't shadowban anyone. Tell me more about how corporate shills suffer from our intolerance.

Or just latch onto my casual endorsement of censorship. It's relative, I assure you. If I could censor homopohobia and racism from the airwaves, or censor terrrism from the television, I would.

But that's irrelevant and irrelative to your complaint of intolerance. Comparatively against every other large subreddit, /r/conspiracy is by far the most tolerant. Prove me wrong.

It goes in waves.

Gimme a break guys. I'm just trying make a few shekels here.

What people should be doing is looking both at the evidence for and against the official scenario, and for and against the alternative hypothesis, and deciding which best fits the available data. A lot of the time, it must be said that isn't the alternative hypothesis: acknowledging this or pointing it out should not make you a "shill" or "conspiratard".

Another pet peeve is not applying the same level of scrutiny to all evidence e.g. going over every detail of the NIST report with a fine-tooth comb, but ignoring completely the severe questions which have been raised about the Harrit paper. Or thinking that because the official explanation is imperfect or incomplete, this "proves" the alternative hypothesis "must" be true.

Really, the critical thinking in this sub is frequently woeful and horribly one-sided, so is of little or no help in finding the truth.

What I've noticed is it's become a haven for non-conspiratorial propaganda against Jews in general.

I don't mean the "Israel controls the US" so much as "Jews give babies herpes because the Rabbis use their mouths during ancient circumcision rituals" type of posts.

That's not a conspiracy.

What is a meta-conspiracy is that members of Stormfront were encouraging people to come to this very subreddit and recruit people into the White nationalist movement. Now a year or so later these propaganda posts are what routinely make it to the top.

No, I don't have evidence of this. It exists. I saw it in /r/conspiracy.

Actually, here you go. https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/search?q=stormfront&restrict_sr=on&sort=relevance&t=all

It happens enough that I notice and I'm on here once or twice a day.

Nah, but right now the particular post about circumcisions is #20.

well shit sorted by Hot, not top.

The news article doesn't belong in Conspiracy. I only see one reason for it to be here and that relates to the folks who came over here from Stormfront.

I don't care what your opinion on circumcision is and I have no reason to continue this topic with you. I admitted I was wrong a few hours back.

I guess this one is directed at me too. I didn't downvote anything.

Circumcision is pointless almost 100% of the time.

Also check out the theory I wrote about the JTRIG leak (it's in my submissions), might or might not be related.

Teenagers.

Conspirtard secret is that they love us so they spend all their time here to make us think other wise

That's the real conspiracy.

what a shitty job they have. they obviously hate us but they need to stick around here each day.

what a bunch of fat losers

You've had a bad day haven't you? You are absolutely livid about something, and projecting hard. Hope home life is alright.

really, where they found you people :D

so are you a shill? do you feel we are talking about you or what?

I wish I got paid to surf the web... I'm sorry life is hard for you right now though. I went through a pretty bad depression where I would lash out at people who didnt agree with me. You know what I did to fix it? I slowed down on the weed consumption and started working out. Those 2 minor changes completely changed my perspective on life, the paranoia went away and I got a better grasp on how to handle the ups and downs. My life is so much more fulfilling now that I don't just come home from work, spark a bowl, and then sit on my computer for a couple hours. I am so much happier.

I am so much happier.

that is great. now don't forget to take your pills each day. we don't want to get back to depression, do we?

Actually, it was the weed fucked with me mentally. No pills, just a great body and healthy outlook on life is needed. Get off the computer and go outside, you'd be amazed by how much better you will feel! It might even reduce that helpless rage you have bottled up inside!

I dunno, but I bet it's something fishy!

It's not going to be too long before us legit users are going to have to find a new place to spread the truth. That being said, never give up.

Same thing with /pol/ at the moment. One mention of the $hoah and they're all over it.

Any site that challenges a monied agenda becomes an attractive target for corruption, to monied interests.

Impotent losers punch down.

word up

I am, generally, anti-conspiracy theory. Why do I come here? It's entertaining to see how things are being spun by this community and to engage in conversations I have limited access to in the real world.

You mean people downvoting people calling the Chattanooga shooting yesterday a false flag operation before we even knew the shootings were over?

I thought the goal of anyone willing to participate here was to be open to new ideas, not blindly scream "every news story ever is a conspiracy!!!"

Well, how about you give us some actual examples then.

the 9/11 thread that got hijacked is one that comes to mind.

Hehe hijacked.

Link? Not all of us live here.

Just post on my secret Fora which is invisible to google

This Fora is compromised, mine isn't.

Don't bash it till you try it, every Fora has smart and dumb Posters

http://www.jduderground.com/dome

Yep they do that from time to time and then act like any dissenting opinion gets banned....nope, it's only those assholes that get banned.

Everyone left to make their own content on their own blogs and wrap it with their own ads and sell their own tshirts and plushies and stickers.

You guys need help. Jk.

Haha yes sorry. But yeah there are a lot of trolls here. I just started visiting this sub this week but you guys have a serious troll problem. It makes reading comments less enjoyable.

A conversation here on an controversial matter is worse than anything politics-wise on 9gag. Pure bullshit

Most are moving on. Start in that direction too.

r/conspiracy comrads, its time time we go on the offense. Full on Blitzkreig against shills, no holds barred!

This subreddit is plagued by the inexperience of its user base. While certain people are willing to carry out due dilligence to facts, it seems many of the vocal participants (dare i say the majority) approach the serious topics in the sub from a limited world view and lack of perspective that is probably creditable to the fact the so much of reddit is 20 something year old white men to begin with and the subject matter of the community tends to draw that type.

I, being the uncle Tom I am, am not unwilling to say that I am a member of the 20-something white man group and have experienced the realization that I don't have all the answers first hand. That said, I am still unwilling to accept that the official story is always true. However, I am also not willing to accept the concept that everything is lies and the product of collusion.

The reason I bring this up, is that when people on the sub react critically of a post it does not necessarily indicate that the rebuke is being made by someone from /r/conspiratard. It could well be that one of the 300000 free thinkers thinks your theory is crap. If you're noticing a lot of criticism in the comments, maybe it has something to do with a post being crap. Maybe everything doesn't have to be a conspiracy by those that would persecute us.

tl;dr: A lot of newfags in this bitch making shit posts and getting called out for it by oldfags.

Nope.

If you're talking about shaming that's another issue. You should clarify your post. The way it is currently worded gives the impression you are reacting criticism. Your exact wording "responded negatively negative comment" is where I misunderstood you.

Maybe take your newfag/oldfag shit back to 4chan?

Maybe you should take a moment to engage a person before you get all pissy?

Not sure how that is substantively different. But i changed it so you can proceed.

I wish we had a way of openly tagging users that come in the community. Like in RES you can ignore and highlight people based on my interactions with them. It would be helpful, here and elsewhere, if you could download an extension and see a breakdown of what other people thought of them (obviously a shill, climate denier and so on and so forth) so we could get a sense of where someone who says things like that is coming from - be it a place of genuine skepticism or of some ulterior motive.

And I could tag you with, unwilling to remain civil

6 week cycle hit yesterday. It'll pass in time.

It's nice outside...

The six week cycle hit this past weekend and was already in the news. Yesterday's shooting involved actual property damage and deaths - something that is rare with the 6 week cycle. But hey, let's ignore that -

Don't you know every bad thing that has ever happened in the history of the world was because of a conspiracy of the jewish bankers. What? you now can easily dismiss the actual corruption uncovered because it is more of that non-sensical, non-fact based, chicken little level idiocy?

2/10

Use them to your advantage. They inadvertently steer you towards the truth.

Downvotes are the breadcrumbs of fuckery.

I'm opposed to the conspiracy theorists, but I don't say "you're crazy" and "get help" and the like. I say "SHOW ME SOME SOLID EVIDENCE". And the CT's fail; they can't so it. All they have is "questions" and innuendo and speculation and gaps in the official investigation.

Its not just this sub. Its the internet. WE are losing my friend.

It's a cockroach hotel. Just standard mind manipulation stuff.

I have never said anything like "get help". I've been a commenter here for years, but when people post shit about pyramid magic and reptilian shapeshifters, I tend to (when I bother and have an hour to waste) point out why that stuff is factually disprovable.

A lot of that crap comes from people trying to make us look like nutcases. Did you notice there was a recent and kind of brief uptick in posts by "flat earthers" and just as quick it's gone? Don't get me started on the racists who are actually just honestly stupid bigots, trying find new recruits.

I've been here a looong time (don't believe me? take the - off the end of my username; I didn't say I remembered my original password). This sub has gone from Ron Paul dislikes the Fed", "Here's something interesting about a Secret Society", etc. to "Israel did something shitty!", "Here's some easily disprovable bullshit about ancient civilization alien pyramid blah blah."

There are disinfo agents. Most likely in this sub, trying to make us look like idiots. But remember, there are a lot more actual idiots, some taken in by their lies.

You are all crazy, go get help! /s

Seriously, shills follow some kind of manual, you can detect them by the tactics. This is maybe the most clear one, so call them out and don't feed them

Remember, if anyone disagrees with your theory that has no basis in fact, it is only because they are paid to disagree, not that your theory has absolutely no proof whatsoever.

Not really, one can disagree and argue to try to show the other part that he/she is wrong. Shills clearly try to ridicule and insult, to neutralize (they would say), it is the easiest tactic and one of the first ones they will use.

Even thought when something obvious comes up, like flat earth society, you know they are 99% shills trying to spread disinfo and discredit all conspiracy facts seekers. In that case, it should be allowed to call out the shills and ridicule their dishonest shill job. I'll still have pity for the 1% who fall for their shit

fuck them! :) made them work hard today. they even had to reset a 200+comment submission.

now is on frontpage, not easy to deal with this as the votes to promote it there is provided by reddit internal staff but I've made them earn their shitty pay today.

ha, they still mention me in that post. probably watching to see if I show up.

these shills are kind of entertaining. in a stupid and retarded way but hey from morons you can't expect much.

they've got so mad that they started to believe i work for putin. fuck so fucking idiots

links are here

https://np.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/3dmege/this_is_really_funny_first_they_create_a_mh17/

Man, I doubt it'll do any good, but its already been explained to you a few times. The original OP even came forward in the new thread and said he deleted it because he thought it was fake.

https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/3dluxg/nsfw_new_footage_of_prorussian_separatists/ct6kpqg

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oh hello!

look who is here

I look for evidence to support what I believe. I'm not going to shy away from that here.

Believe what you want to believe. Look at the link. You're making a claim that isn't true. Sorry.

mods needs a bigger ban hammer, or start dual-wielding.

Those conspiritards are needed to be put in concentration camps then all gassed in giant chamber n buried in mass graves

That would be the first instance in history of gas chambers being used...

No california using em to get rid of poor unwanted people

What are you trying to say I do?

What I try and do is have strong evidence behind my beliefs.

That's the real conspiracy.

links are here

https://np.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/3dmege/this_is_really_funny_first_they_create_a_mh17/

If you're talking about shaming that's another issue. You should clarify your post. The way it is currently worded gives the impression you are reacting criticism. Your exact wording "responded negatively negative comment" is where I misunderstood you.

Maybe take your newfag/oldfag shit back to 4chan?

Maybe you should take a moment to engage a person before you get all pissy?

This is a major flaw because if you want to say everything just stays connected then you would need to have the opposite force headed against the spin which we don't see either.

You've had a bad day haven't you? You are absolutely livid about something, and projecting hard. Hope home life is alright.

I assure you I'm not trolling.

Link? Not all of us live here.

Hehe hijacked.

Actually, it was the weed fucked with me mentally. No pills, just a great body and healthy outlook on life is needed. Get off the computer and go outside, you'd be amazed by how much better you will feel! It might even reduce that helpless rage you have bottled up inside!

lol okay.

Gee I wonder why there is such a disparity in the death tolls. Hmmm... what could it possibly be?

I'm not a mod. The list is on the side. They are here. Several participate regularly in discussion.