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lol sounds like problem solution all over again.

i for one had them against my wishes as a child, but am against them for if im to have kids.

because of the autism scare ive lost trust in them

i dont doubt the possibility things like polio were introduced as a means to get people ok with taking shots and basically cause the driving need for things like big pharma in the long run

THC has been proven to be better than so many pills and medications for certain illnesses, so i lose trust more for it being made illegal over Dupont shares and easy incarceration.. damn you Anslinger! everything we see is about money and control

your kids need schooling by law and to be birthed... birth em in a hospital and risk him getting something in his sytem asap. you send him to public school/college and he/she needs to be vaccinated.. the fact its lawful makes me lose trust

i care about children too much to leave faith in the government approved ways, especially if the kids will be mine. we know TPTB are more against us than for us, they act like theyre for us.. duh, or else we wouldnt have these chats at all. im not gonna suddenly leap for trust in this field when all the others signs tell me not to.

There was a time when doctors prescribed antibiotics for just about anything. They were safe, effective and relatively cheap.

Some people warned we were using them too much, but except for a few extreme reactions, they were seen as harmless.

Then MRSA and other antibiotic resistant mutations started showing up. Doctors began to get concerned. They had become so reliant on antibiotics they were afraid if antibiotics stopped working we'd be back in the 'dark ages' of medicine where even a minor scratch could kill you.

You see, evolution doesn't just stop because we invent a drug. In fact quite the opposite. The more pressure we put on the survival of these pathogens, the more rapid their evolution. We became an artificial source of selection, making sure only the mutations could survive and creating "superbugs" by accident.

Now think about measles. More and more often now, the measles virus is infecting and sickening fully vaccinated people. It appears the measles virus might be evolving resistance to the vaccine. Throwing more vaccine at the problem will only make things worse, by increasing the evolutionary pressure on the virus.

We could be seeing the first stages of the evolution of viral "superbugs".

There is no need to vaccinate everyone against measles (for example). Apart from the fact that modern medical care means very few infected people will die from measles (there was a 90% reduction in measles mortality before the invention of the vaccine), using vaccine only to stop the spread of an outbreak is just as effective as vaccinating every child born.

The reason we don't do this is because the corporations that make the measles vaccines make huge profits from giving medicine to healthy people. They want every person to take multiple doses - the more the better - so they don't care if they have to keep increasing the dosage as the virus becomes more resistant. They don't care if the side effects of their drug harms more kids than the disease does. They only care about the billions of dollars they can make.

Like antibiotics, they will keep encouraging doctors to vaccinate when it is not necessary because it makes them barrels of money, and they wont stop until it becomes clear their vaccines no longer work, and we're left with a measles virus that is more deadly than ever before, with no effective way to contain it.

Read the studies and explanations on this site. It should get you started.

http://vaccinepapers.org

I think the concept is good. I'm not sure if the application always follows stringent testing when there's a rush to get a vaccine to market.

Do they cause autism? I believe so in some cases.

Do they intentionally cause autism? I wouldnt think so generally.. but thats not to say the logistics wouldnt be possible if some nefarious villain wanted to!

Well if you look into the numbers affected by the HPV vax, it is creeping upwards. And the problem is the damage that it does. Leaving a number of young girls completely paralysed is not a good reputation builder.

A side effect is one thing, a life changing paralyses is something else altogether.

Here's a list of victims from my own country. We have roughly 400+ reported cases, as our population is only 4mill this made me sit up and take notice. The US or elsewhere may be different. Also, this is in regards to a specific HPV vaccine called Gardasil.

https://www.regret.ie/victims_2.html

Just so we're clear, i dont think the HPV vaccine is a bad idea, however i do think a growing issue is being somewhat downplayed by those with interests.

This is the case that made me look into it a little more. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AK9ypglecg

I could agree with you if the effects were somewhat less, like i said im not opposed to the vaccine. My issue is that once cases of total paralyses start cropping up, the product should be pulled for immediate testing.

I dont know your age but you may remember the thalidomide scandal? Thats what happens when capitalism escapes the restraint of oversight due to the power behind pharma.

Autism

makes the best Reddit investigators! /s

You should never need to make an argument in favor of free will.

It's not a fair comparison. Intentional vs non intentional is a key factor. Until you can 100% guarantee that a non vaccinated individual will be the cause of someone else's death, then it's speculation.

My chances of dying increase GREATLY when I get behind the wheel of a car, should I not be allowed to drive because I may kill myself or someone else?

Wearing a helmet might save your life one day, maybe it should be the law that you should wear a helmet at ALL times?

I'm wondering the same thing as my first child is due in a couple of months. I already plan on refusing the HepB vaccine in the hospital because I am not infected. I have heard horror stories about nurses threatening to call CPS on parents for not complying with such vaccines, although I cannot vouch for how authentic those claims are. I actually find myself afraid to not vaccinate my child further because I am not sure if the hype about vaccines is overblown and I am actually putting my child at further risk of disease for no reason and I am also afraid of the social/legal consequences down the line with doctors, schools, etc. I just don't know where this massive uptick in autism is coming from and I want to protect my child as much as possible, let me know if anyone decided not to vaccinate their child and what if any resistance you were met with.

There is a whistleblower that exposed fraudulent results reported on mmr positive association with autism in black males less than age 3.

http://healthimpactnews.com/2015/will-cdc-whistleblower-on-vaccines-testify-before-congress/print/

However, there are many other associations other than simply autism and simply with the mmr vaccine.

let me know if anyone decided not to vaccinate their child and what if any resistance you were met with.

I chose to delay any vaccination of my second child until he was two. At that point, we gave him vaccines but we never gave him more than one in a day and we spread them out so he never had more than one within a three month period. There are a couple that weren't available split up (for instance, they bundle measles, mumps, rubella into one shot, and I couldn't get him just a measles shot alone). I chose to go ahead and use the bundled vaccines because although I think there's inherent risk in the current vaccine schedule, I still value vaccination.

We met with no resistance whatsoever. My kids have had the same pediatricians (they're extremely mainstream, not naturopaths or anything) their whole lives and the doctors and staff have never so much as given me a dirty look about my stance.

Combining Childhood Vaccines at One Visit Is Not Safe

Our study showed that infants who receive several vaccines concurrently, as recommended by CDC, are significantly more likely to be hospitalized or die when compared with infants who receive fewer vaccines simultaneously. It also showed that reported adverse effects were more likely to lead to hospitalization or death in younger infants. These findings are so troubling that we expected major media outlets in America to sound an alarm, calling for an immediate reevaluation of current preventive health care practices. But 4 years after publication of our study, this has not happened. Could it be because, according to Robert Kennedy, Jr., about 70% of advertising revenue on network news comes from drug companies?

So even if all of the claims about vaccines and autism were true (which if you read my comment, they're probably not), you'd still be statistically way better off vaccinating your kids.

Why? Because 25% of mortalities from children under 5 come from vaccine-preventable diseases. That's huge compared to even the most generous estimation of risk of autism. In other words it's way more likely that your kid gets a bad cough, fever, and dies before you can save him as opposed to you vaccinating your kids and causing them autism or paralysis or any other negative externalities attributed to vaccines.

If you want to protect your kids, focus on the food they eat. Diet is 80% of health, exercise is 10%, and proper medical care is 10% or less. Spend more money to get locally-grown, organic vegetables that dont have genetic modifications which are solely designed to allow massive amounts of pesticides to be used on them. Watch their sugar intake more than anything. 50 years from now, we will look back and see sugar as the biggest health tragedy in history. Salt and fat are not causing all this heart disease and obesity....it's sugar. Id be happy to show you studies about that. The point is, vaccinate your kids, ban sodas, added sugar, and processed foods, and you'll be way better off

My grandpa had polio as a kid, I can't remember ever hearing of someone having polio since. In that sense, I think it's undeniable that vaccines can work. What I question is what is actually in a vaccine, I've read, but never been able to substantiate, that many vaccines contain harmful compounds like mercury and formaldehyde, why those are in vaccines I don't understand. I also think we may be giving people too many vaccines too early or quickly, I can see giving a few vital vaccines to infants but it seems we bombard their little immune systems with too much. That said, I'm not a medical professional.

The ingredients are listed on the package inserts, which you can search online for each vaccine. In US and Canada only, Pharma removed the mercury (thermiserol) bec it is a documented neurotoxin, but it is still part of the flu vaccine. However another neurotoxin in all current vaccines is aluminum --and infants get multiple loads with several vaccines given together.

Good to know. I haven't had anything past the mandatory vaccinations for years now.

Only for my pets.

A little background, I am a medical student who also works in a lab doing Neuroscience research, so I have some experience in scientific/statistical analysis, but am by no means an expert. This is by no means exhaustive, but I think vaccine controversy should be separated into a few different categories because some evidence is strong and other claims are not.

1) vaccines and autism: I usually like ben Swann because he usually does an even handed job but still calls out real news that the MSM won't talk about (like pizzagate and 9/11)

Here's his documentary that covers what I see as one of the bigger "criticisms" linking vaccines to autism https://youtu.be/ZDbtWytZxxE

Andrew wakefield (also in Swann video) tried to make something of this 3 years ago with his own video. This link has a pretty good analysis of what actually went down.

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/did-a-high-ranking-whistleblower-really-reveal-that-the-cdc-covered-up-proof-that-vaccines-cause-autism-in-african-american-boys/

As someone who actually does medical research, and also happens to be a conspiracy theorist, I'd say that the majority of the vaccine thing in relation to autism does not hold water. The statistics they rely on to make positive claims about vaccines and autism are incorrectly processed (meaning they run one statistical test when they should have used a different one) and slightly manipulated to achieve a level of significance which the scientific community accepts.

That being said, there is unequivocally something going on with autism. The explosion of autism over the past two decades is both astounding and alarming. The national autism foundation even admits that the increased rate of autism cannot be fully explained by increased access to care, increased diagnosis, etc. In other words something (s) are causing more autism. The thing is, it's a "spectrum disorder", which means that it is extremely multifactorial. Gene's probably play a role, chemicals in the environment probably play a role, but given all of the evidence, it seems unlikely that Vaccines play a significant role, the accurate statistics just aren't there. Now, to be fair, it is medically unethical/illegal to run a randomized trial which prospectively compares non-vaccinated children to vaccinated ones. So you can argue that we will never have definitive proof that there is no link. But right now there's not enough proof to say there is a link.

2)the real danger of vaccines:

What is true is that Vaccine-preventable diseases are still responsible for about 25% of the 10 million deaths occurring annually among children under 5 years of age. Now, that being said, like with any medical treatment, vaccines are by no means 100% safe. Take India and Bill Gates as an example: "while India has been polio-free for a year, there has been a huge increase in non-polio acute flaccid paralysis (NPAFP). In 2011, there were an extra 47,500 new cases of NPAFP. Clinically indistinguishable from polio paralysis but twice as deadly, the incidence of NPAFP was directly proportional to doses of oral polio received. "

http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/01/bbc-dark-side-bill-gates-polio-dimbleby.html

It is obvious that the vaccine in this case is causing more harm than good. India has even cut funding ties with the gates foundation. Side note, as a conspiracy theorist who follows Bill Gates closely and his track record of sterilization in Africa, I think he's quite fond of global depopulation, and wouldn't let him within 100ft of my children.

Furthermore, in developing countries, irradiation of most diseases is an issue of infrastructure, sanitation, and education....not vaccines. The notion that were wasting so much money on vaccines when we should be spending it to develop their infrastructure is just silly to me.

3) state-mandated vaccines. To me this is the biggest point that anti vaxxers don't really spend enough time on. To most scientists, vaccines are acceptably safe and have way more benefit than harm. To me however, that shouldnt be the question. The question should be, even if they are good, safe, etc...should we be allowing the government to mandate medical treatments on us? One can argue that children are too young to make that choice so we should vaccinate them anyway to protect them from their parents'...I don't agree with that. Furthermore, there's solid data from this Harvard immunologist that shows that unvaccinated children do not have greater infectivity than vaccinated ones for the majority of vaccines we give.

http://www.healthnutnews.com/harvard-immunologist-unvaccinated-children-pose-zero-risk/

So, we know there is some danger, and we know that 30 years ago kids were getting like 5 vaccines, now they get like 45, even though nothing has really changed in the environment. That's mostly the work of greedy big pharma and the control they have over government regulations. For that reason I am personally opposed to mandating vaccines (which we basically do in this country via the public school system). That being said, I am absolutely going to vaccinate my kids, because it does save lives, and I think the risk of my children dying of a vaccine-preventable disease is way higher than the chance that it causes him to be autistic or any other adverse effect.

I believe the older, more proven vaccines like for polio, measles, rubella, hepatitis B and A, are more safe.. I also believe the rise in number of vaccines given to infants and newborns is out of control in the US and should be scheduled differently.

I understand the theory and believe vaccination might be helpful but there are many cases of harm and corruption between government agencies and coporate entities that it brings into question the safety of the current vaccines and schedules.

I came to say something similar. I had to have my children vaccinated to be enrolled in school. It was a good idea that kept down some previously devastating and common diseases. Of course all of my offspring are now well into adulthood.

So when I first started reading about the controversy I was stunned at just how many damned vaccines they give now. And while there's extensive testing on the active ingredients, there are reported problems with the inert suspensions they are delivered through that require little or no testing.

And keep in mind that these all come to us from profit driven pharmaceutical companies that have been show time and again to release drugs with woefully inadequate or downright deceptive testing results.

Yes

Giving the State the authority to compel a physician to violate a citizen's biological integrity is a slippery slope. Think of all the procedures that could be mandated in the name of the greater societal good. Compulsory sterilization or abortion come to mind. Non-voluntary euthanasia. Coerced contraception. Forced micro-chip implantation.

Vaccine technology is a modern marvel. I'm thrilled to live in a place and time where I don't have to worry about polio or yellow fever. But modern governments are not quite so marvelous and need to be reigned in when they attempt to overstep their authority.

My personal opinion is that vaccination is not justified.

Diseases like Pertussis, Diptheria and Measles were already on the decline before the introduction of the vaccines.

Polio appears to decline after the introduction of vaccination, but this is because the disease was redefined. Before the vaccination was introduced, in 1954, only two examinations 24 hours apart were required to diagnose the disease (go to page 23).

After the vaccine was introduced, the criteria for diagnosis was made more stringent. It now required a final examination 60 days after the initial referral. In other words the figures were fiddled in order to artificially decrease the incidence of Polio. Go to page 418.

The scientific theory for vaccination, building immunity against viruses, is flawed. Viruses do not exist.

A recent court case in Germany found that the Measles virus has never been isolated. This is a quotation from the transcript for the case:

"The phenomena presented as measles viruses are actually cellular vesicles."

Antibodies are (supposedly) the molecules which control what is known as antigen specific immunity. If they exist, then they are not the shape that they are reported as being. Thispicture is not consistent with what we expect from Y-shaped objects, based on the laws of 3D geometry.

As Harold Hillman states in his work, the receptors on white blood cells have never been seen on electron micrographs. All cell membranes seen are completely smooth.

Here is an excerpt I don't have the link for, but you can look up the info online --it refers to Pharma's unethical manipulation of research design to rig the results they want. How can anything their studies show be taken seriously?

There are two former Merck virologists who filed a qui tam suit against Merck, the manufacturer of the very same MMR vaccine. (Ref: Federal Civil Lawsuit: UNITED STATES OF AMERICA et al. v. MERCK & CO., Pennsylvania Eastern District Court, Case No. 2:10-cv-04374-CDJ, District Judge C. DARNELL JONES, II, presiding)

The suit claims Merck defrauded the US government by selling the vaccine, under a federal contract, when Merck knew the mumps component of the vaccine was far less effective than advertised.

Of course, Merck disputed this claim, but on September 5th, 2014, Judge Jones, of the Federal District Court for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania, gave the green light for the suit to move forward.

Kraling and Wlochowski assert several levels of Merck fraud:

To achieve a slam-dunk success, Merck tested the effectiveness of the MMR vaccine against the version of the virus in the vaccine, rather than against the natural mumps virus a person would catch in the real world.

Merck irrelevantly and deceptively added animal antibodies to the test results, thus giving the false appearance of strong human immune response to the vaccine.

On top of that, Merck faked the quantitative results of the tests to which the animal antibodies had been added.

Physicians are beginning to question the CDC/Pharma schedule and research methods. However, they are being "silenced".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvXIqUyOdK4

In the video above, Dr. Mark Geier explains the fraud behind the flu vaccine. Dr. Geier is NOT anti-vaccine. He is an M.D. and has a Ph.D. in genetics. He spent 10 years working at the National Institute of Health, and was a professor at Johns Hopkins University as a geneticist. He is also the author of over 150 peer-reviewed publications. He worked on vaccine safety and efficacy for more than 30 years. He was one of four scientists that worked to replace the DTP vaccine, a vaccine that caused every child to become sick with a high fever at the time of vaccination, with the DTaP vaccine, which is a more purified vaccine and causes illness due to fever in only 3% of those vaccinated. In the video above, he explains that the flu shot causes Guillain-Barré Syndrome, and that the flu shot is not very effective in preventing the flu. He also explains that the CDC does not follow the law for vaccines in requiring long-term safety testing for the influenza vaccine like they do with other vaccines, as it is impossible to test a vaccine that changes every year. So the flu vaccine is basically an experimental vaccine that they want to give out to 300 million people every year. There are also no studies showing the safety of giving the flu vaccine to the same person every single year. However, Dr. Geier points out that the CDC is in the business of distributing flu vaccines, because they represent 300 million doses per year, whereas all the childhood vaccines together only number 20 million. Dr. Geier goes on to explain that flu is “the wrong thing to vaccinate against” because you have to keep re-vaccinating against it every year, unlike childhood infectious diseases, such as smallpox, that are only vaccinated for once. Dr. Geier points out how ridiculous it is spend billions of dollars on a vaccine that might, at its best, save about 50 lives a year, when there are far more serious problems causing death that are more worthy of that kind of expenditure.|

Just picked this up from this sub --

Physician -why has CDC lost the public's trust.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/vaccines-and-the-centers-for-disease-control-cdr-bad-science-or-willful-ignorance-why-the-cdc-has-lost-its-trustworthiness/5521667

The most simple answer is: We definitely need them and they can definitely be tampered with.

Wearing a helmet might save your life one day, maybe it should be the law that you should wear a helmet at ALL times?