The guy who was stabbed was American...

Did you even try to look before you commented?

Private Stanley Mellish was a supporting character in the film, Saving Private Ryan. He was a Jewish-American soldier, and a member of Miller's Squad during the later stages of World War Two. He had a strong dislike for the Nazis due to their public persecution and slaughter of the Jews.

http://savingprivateryan.wikia.com/wiki/Stanley_Mellish

Are you saying the character that was stabbed isn't an American? Where am I wrong?

You were clearly implying that he wasn't Jewish as a rebuttal to the OP.

No, I was letting OP know that the Jewish guy who was stabbed was an American. He didn't seem to realize that.

And....

He was speaking English and fighting with U.S. forces alongside the protagonist. Unless OP hasn't ever watched the movie that doesn't make any sense. I'm not doing a back and forth with your ego here. Sometimes you need to grow a pair and admit when you're wrong.

I don't understand what your point is or what your disagreeing with. I'm saying the Jewish guy was an American. Do you disagree with that?

Why the fuck do none of you ever just explain what the fuck you mean or answer any questions. Was the Jewish man that was stabbed and American soldier or not?

Opening line of OP:

Consider one of the final scenes in the movie (spoiler) where the Jewish guy is slowly stabbed in the heart by the Nazi, while the cowardly American stands by and does nothing.

Your first comment, including the trailing periods:

The guy who was stabbed was American...

So either you're wasting time by reiterating an obvious fact that only someone who didn't watch the movie wouldn't know, or you were trying to posit a rebuttal that the person stabbed wasn't Jewish.

You know Israel wasn't around yet, right?

That wasn't even a concern in this chain of comments. Jewish people also existed before modern-day Israel. Have fun confusing the fuck out of other people on your own.

OP implies that the Jewish guy was not American by trying to say that some OTHER American soldier was too scared to help the Jewish guy.

After he just called you "very confused" and probably gave up trying to argue with you:

https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/6twrqf/saving_private_ryan_is_zionist_propaganda/dlo8f22/

I think this entire thing is going over your head. The Jewish-American soldier still represents Jewish people even though he's fighting with U.S. forces in this movie. He's ethnically Jewish and I think OP is pretty close to being right. The state of Israel was also in planning long before the end of WW2. The Balfour Declaration was written in 1917 so it doesn't really matter whether modern-day Israel was formally recognized yet.

Rocky was Italian. He must represent Italy. Does that mean all of his movies were about Italy destroying black people and Russians? Hmm, you and OP might be on to something.

The guy being Jewish DEFINITELY wasn't just an interesting plot line, but a more diabolical shot at the United States for not saving the Jews and forming Israel quicker. Got it!

Rocky was Italian. He must represent Italy. Does that mean all of his movies were about Italy destroying black people and Russians?

Rocky was a best friend of Apollo, the African-American you're referring to. He didn't kill him. There are some theories that the Rocky movies were anti-communist propaganda.

In other news. You were either wrong this whole time and trying to appear like you weren't, or you've never watched Saving Private Ryan and just ran your mouth to try and make a conspiracy theorist (on r/conspiracy) look dumb. Either way you're incredibly difficult to converse with and I'm done here.

In what way was I wrong about saying the Jewish guy who was stabbed was American?

https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/6twrqf/saving_private_ryan_is_zionist_propaganda/dlo8qnh/

Its an incredibly simple question that has taken a very long time for you to supply an answer.

You already asked the question and I already answered. Stop wasting time and arguing in circles. You're wrong because you're lying about what you meant in your original comment. I will stop feeding trolls now.

I'm not trolling. Lol. The Jewish guy was an American soldier. This is nuts.

That wasn't your point or original sentiment. You were trying to say he wasn't a Jew. Goodbye.

Holy fuck I literally called him Jewish.

This whole thing just went over your head dude. OP never implied Stanley Mellish wasn't an American and only someone who hasn't watched the movie would say something absurd like that. He was a Jewish American not being helped by a Caucasian American. It doesn't matter that they're both fighting with U.S. forces. Stanley Mellish still represents the Jews in OP's theory.

It didn't go over my head. I think he's making something out to be nothing. That Nazi soldier then walked down the stairs past the American. Does that mean we were secretly friends with the Nazis? Theories can be made up about anything.

That Nazi soldier then walked down the stairs past the American. Does that mean we were secretly friends with the Nazis?

Now you're getting the hang of this. Yes.

I'm sorry I didn't mean to be so insulting. I think we were both confused. Have a good day.

The message is basically that America waited too long to intervene to stop the Nazis.

Is that incorrect?

Is that incorrect?

The US should've never gotten into the war. The only reason we did was because of the false flag that was Pearl Harbor.

You essentially were in the war. Sometimes the best thing isn't what the public wants.

Also without America you would have had the soviet union very likely control all of europe

Switzerland didn't mind staying neutral, why couldn't the US? Wasn't our fight, we were thousands of miles away on a separate continent.

Again, would you really want the soviets controlling all of europe?

Switzerland has a long history of neutrality,they also weren't worth the effort if conquering.

Don't forget that Hitler declared war on the US and not the other way around.

Again, would you really want the soviets controlling all of europe?

I don't give a shit about who controls Europe, to be honest. I'm an American on a different continent. You guys deal with your shit over there.

Switzerland has a long history of neutrality,they also weren't worth the effort if conquering.

You're point?

Don't forget that Hitler declared war on the US and not the other way around.

That was because the US declared war on Japan. They were allies at the time. Convenient, huh? Pearl Harbor was a false flag. We instigated it, and then let it happen.

Well that would skew the cold war massively in the favour of the ussr.

My point is why they stayed nuetral. The Germans were far too preoccupied.

Even if pearl harbour was baited it doesn't matter. Japan attacked America so of course they declared war (japan did so the next day). Germany wasn't obliged to also declare war on the US, just as Japan didn't declare war on the USSR. So yeah Hitler's stupidity was convenient

Well that would skew the cold war massively in the favour of the ussr.

There would've been no cold war, dude.

My point is why they stayed nuetral. The Germans were far too preoccupied.

Yet, they were planning on invading the US homeland? Doesn't make sense.

Germany wasn't obliged to also declare war on the US

Yes, they were. As for Japan and the USSR https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet%E2%80%93Japanese_War_(1945). A declaration really didn't have to be made.

So America and the ussr wouldn't have bothered trying to make the most powerful weapons in history?

So just ignore the county that declaredwar on you and forsake the peoples of europe?

See you missed the date. 1945, 4 years after barbarossa. And look the soviets attacked first. Care to try again?

So America and the ussr wouldn't have bothered trying to make the most powerful weapons in history?

They probably would've still done that, but it wouldn't be as hostile. Why did we help them, in order to demonize them? Prior to WWII the US was not a super power. After, we were. Hence the hostilities between the two powers. That was by design. Once again, see Switzerland.

So just ignore the county that declaredwar on you and forsake the peoples of europe?

There would've been no declaration, if we didn't instigate Japan into war. How are you not understanding that?

See you missed the date. 1945, 4 years after barbarossa. And look the soviets attacked first. Care to try again?

Are you confused by my answer to your remark?

Nazism was the bigger threat than communism. America would have become a superpower in anycase I believe. The public didn't like communism at all, look back to the red scare. By design?

Japan invaded Britain, their rapid expansion into the pacific threatened America. To stop even more expansion the US put in place an oil embargo

Your answer ignores that the japanese and soviets only went to war in '45, showing they weren't bound to fight the Soviets. Historians agree there was no real reason to declare war on the US, probably was a mix of Hitler's antisemitism and ego that led to it. Especially since the declaration was at the same fime as the germans failed to capture moscow.

Nazism was the bigger threat than communism.

How?

America would have become a superpower in anycase I believe.

That's debatable.

The public didn't like communism at all, look back to the red scare. By design?

Convenient war propaganda.

Japan invaded Britain, their rapid expansion into the pacific threatened America.

How did that threaten the US?

Your answer ignores that the japanese and soviets only went to war in '45, showing they weren't bound to fight the Soviets.

That's not what I was saying. A formal declaration really wasn't needed when you get invaded.

Nazism has mass murder built into its ideology. Plus it wasn't communism but nazism which had nearly totally destroyed all of the democracies in europe.

Agreed it is debatable but no need I can see to get distracted by it for this discussion.

What do you mean by war propaganda?

Firstly threatening American long term security in the Pacific. Only really need to lose a couple of islands to completely lose control. Also the phillipines was an american satellite/ puppet

Yet is still the norm. Do you admit then that germany had no more duties to declare on the US as Japan had to declare on the USSR?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Tannenbaum

But they didn't invade, so it still stands.

How do you feel about Operation Northwoods?

I'm doubtful really. The US didn't do much to squash Germany, but it did keep Japan busy, which made a big difference in Russia's strategic situation.

Well first of all the arctic convoys supplied from 4-10% of the USSR's equipment, mainly American. Maybe Britain could have done something in the style of DDay but I'm not sure it would have been in time and would have been far easier to repel. Also without America sitting on their border with nukes there wouldn't be that much stopping the red army marching to the Atlantic

I dunno. Pretty sure if the US never got involved, we'd all be speaking either German or Russian today.

I'm somewhat sure that if the US never got involved, we'd all be speaking either German or Russian today.

Not true, and merely speculation.

You can't say something is simultaneously not true and also speculation.

There is no evidence that Russia or Germany would've taken over the US if we didn't intervene. Complete propaganda to further justify a needless war founded on lies. There was no Holocaust, it was all about money and Western hegemony, and the creation of Israel. That was one of the last nails in the coffin for the Republic.

There was no Holocaust

Byeeeeeeeeeeeee

Does that trigger you? 6 million -> 4 million -> 1 1/2 million, what's it going to be in 40 years, 200,000?

Lmao, what the fuck.

What, is this new information to you?

If you can put down the bottle long enough I'd love to hear how Pearl Harbor was a false flag, as well as why we shouldn't have stepped in from the Nazi party and Adolf Hitler taking over Europe. Lmao.

The US instigated Japan via sanctions (among other things). The US knew that Japan was going to attack via intelligence, and allowed it to happened. This of course, was at the highest of ranks. As for the Nazis, up until that point, the majority of the US didn't want another world war. They felt Europe should handle their own problems, being that we were isolated from Europe on another continent. People were far more anti-war back then, believe it or not.

As for my ancestors, yes. Poland was raped by both sides. Sadly, either way the Polish usually get the shit deal throughout history. They've fought for their independence for thousands of years, in one form or another. Poland was a hell hole under the Soviets rule, so staying out of the war would've probably been better for them, imo.

Fuck yeah there were sanctions. They sided with the Nazis.

The US knew that Japan was going to attack via intelligence, and allowed it to happened.

Evidence. Yes, there was information that leaked that Japan was focused on our West coast, but how can you prove he KNEW (like you said) that Japan was going to attack Pearl Harbor when they did? FDR and his cabinet considered declaring war on Japan the night before Pearl Harbor as well.

I'm a mutt, but I'm mainly Polish and Slovenian. If you believe that the United States should not have stepped in to help liberate the land of our ancestors from Nazi rule I am ashamed that people like you share my heritage.

That poster has literally praised Hitler in the past:

https://archive.is/lgff6#selection-2219.0-2219.143

Trust me, I'm aware. He plays the "devils advocate" card when it comes to that.

Fuck yeah there were sanctions. They sided with the Nazis.

So? Why was that our problem?

FDR and his cabinet considered declaring war on Japan the night before Pearl Harbor as well.

What a coincidence, no?

If you believe that the United States should not have stepped in to help liberate the land of our ancestors from Nazi rule

After the war we were under Communist rule. Not sure if you're from the East or West, but my family in the East were being genocided by the Soviets. That fact that you do not know that, makes me ashamed to share common ancestry with people like you.

I have ancestors that were assassinated, raped, and murdered by the Soviets. Some old timers in my family actually preferred the Nazis over the Soviets. Granted we were Polish and not Jewish, that is.

If you don't understand why Japan siding with the Nazis, and what the Nazis were doing was a problem there is no hope for you in this discussion.

Explain it to me, then. Don't just take a jab and run away.

I know how discussions with you work. I've made my points and shown you why your opinion is baseless.

Also, you never provided that evidence... which is something you love to accuse other people of doing ;)

What evidence are you looking for? I'd be happy to provide it, if you let me know.

Go back and read through our conversation, bub.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pearl_Harbor_advance-knowledge_conspiracy_theory#Statements_by_high-ranking_officials

That section of the Wikipedia article that you believe is evidence contradicts itself many times.

Yeah, I already acknowledged that FDR and his crew were expecting a possible attack against the United States at some point. We already knew what side we were on in the war before we were even in it, as did Japan.

I asked for evidence that they specifically knew Pearl Harbor was going to be attacked when it was, and how it was. You seem to believe that Roosevelt knew specifically that Pearl Harbor was going to get hit. I'm asking for that proof. There is more legitimacy to the argument that Britain knew more specifics about the attack in advance than Roosevelt.

Poland was a hell hole under the Soviets rule, so staying out of the war would've probably been better for them, imo.

Poland could not stay out of the war. Neither could the soviets so no matter which you are suggesting herw you are completely wrong

I was talking about the fate of Poland with or without the intervention of the US. Re-read my comment.

It still seems to suggest poland had a choice. Or how would it be better for poland without the US?

He's trying to say that it would have been better for the Polish people if the US never entered the war and Nazi Germany stayed in power. Lmao, can't make this shit up.

I really doubt he's saying that. Well I hope not because if he believes that then he is completely ignorant of history (both with nazi ideology and how USSR likely could have won anyway).

I'll let him explain what he means before passing judgement

It still seems to suggest poland had a choice.

How are you getting that from what I said? Poland had no choice in the matter regardless of whether the US intervened. They are squished between the two powers (Germany - Russia).

Or how would it be better for poland without the US?

I'm not saying it would've been better or worse. There fate really had nothing to do with the US intervention. One could say, the US intervention made it worse, being that it was under Soviet control after the war.

Honest question, is English not your first language?

Well all of the interpretations I could make lead to the same conclusion then. You don't actually understand history.

You need to read up on nazi racial theory, the soviets were far kinder to poland than the nazis would have been. To the nazis all poles are sub human. Indeed poland was going to be 'cleansed' of much of its population to make way for German settlers

Yes English is my first language, I tried to give you benefit of the doubt as I couldn't imagine someone seriously claiming poland would be better off controlled by the nazis

I never said they would've been better off, it's subjective. I have horror stories from both sides in my family. The Russians have a longer history of disgust with the Polish than Germany does. Both hated the Polish for some reason, maybe it's because we are the superior race. ^kidding

Anyways, I'm well informed about history, being that is what I do (historian). I also have intimate accounts via personal family history. Many documents and as well as verbal accounts.

At the end of the day, it is of my opinion that the US should've stayed out of the war. By not, is why we are in most of the shit we are today, along with the others we've fought. I am of this belief:

Peace, commerce and honest friendship with all nations; entangling alliances with none.

-Thomas Jefferson

"Poland probably would have been better off under them imo". You clearly did say that. Doesn't matter the length of time, rathwr the intensity. There wouldn't be any poles left under the nazis

Family stories as you know don't paint a proper picture of events. And I don't think you understand nazism at all by what you have said

(Except all the natives we genocided)

I meant according to my understanding and the after math that followed they may have been, imo. Cant say definitively, because I was not alive at the time, nor were you. Like I said, it's truly subjective.

There wouldn't be any poles left under the nazis

You do not know that for sure.

Family stories as you know don't paint a proper picture of events.

You going to tell that to the families of the "Holocaust" survivors, that's their bread and butter and historians take it as gospel?

And I don't think you understand nazism at all by what you have said

I do understand it, just in the factual way. Not the propagandized version.

(Except all the natives we genocided)

What does that have to do with anything, in regards to our conversation?

Read nazi racial theory. The slavs were to be exterminated on qn enormous scale. Of course as a historian I'm sure you understand nazi racial beliefs... and yes I exaggerate but there would be only a tiny number. Mainly slaves of some kind.

Yes. Because historians can't understand the holocaust solely from survivors. Again I'm sure you understand this as a historian

Ah good, so you understand the racial theory, lebens raum (both of which called for mass murder)? That's good

Well just pointing out the US was an immensely expansionist country

The slavs were to be exterminated on qn enormous scale.

That is simply not true. There were ideas circulating for extermination, but assimilation was the chosen one for the Slavic people (Polish being highly desirable). Not saying that is good or anything, but to say Hitler wanted to exterminate Slavs is flat out wrong. They killed Jewish-Poles, sure, but Slavs were seen in high regard to Hitler. There are documents and writings that outline this.

Well just pointing out the US was an immensely expansionist country

I'm failing to see the relevance in our conversation.

I take it you gave up on your poor argument against my point of family records not being particularly great? And that you agree with what I said nazism contained

Umm could you give me some historians who back that up? How was lebensraum going to he achieved without mass murder? And what about the hunger plan?

Slavs were subhuman to the nazis, arguably below the jews to them

Umm could you give me some historians who back that up?

That's the problem, you will not find anything that questions the official narrative.

Guess we are just going to have to agree to disagree.

Yes you do, just there is so much evidence for nazi racial beliefs.

And please tell me about lebensraum? Was this going to be abandoned?

Nice piece of evidence for you to consider, when the nazis got into ukraine they were greeted with offerings of friendship by villages. Why then (beside for racial reasons) did the nazis not utilise this ready support?

As to the first question?

Because we should have happily let the holocaust happen?

And you're reading too much into it, saving private ryan tried to show the true horror of modern warfare, including when people are too scared to do anything. The vast majority of people aren't rambo

And there are layers to the film. Remember when they shoot the surrendering 'German' soldiers above the beach? They were czech conscripts

Munich is an absolutely unapologetic revenge fantasy about the Munich Massacre. The film totally ignores the complexity of the situation and the crimes committed by Israel against Palestinians.

Er, no?

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/israel-attacks-spielberg-over-munich-his-movie-on-1972-olympics-massacre-520603.html

Two weeks ago, Israel's consul general in Los Angeles, Ehud Danoch, emerged from an advance screening and promptly denounced the film in a series of interviews as "presumptuous" and "superficial".

Accusing Spielberg and his team of putting Mossad and the Palestinian guerrilla group Black September on the same moral plane, he complained: "This is an incorrect moral equation. We in Israel know this."

Yesterday, after several days of doubt over whether he was speaking officially or merely giving his personal reaction, Mr Danoch's remarks were fully backed up by the Israeli foreign ministry, according to a report in the entertainment newspaper Variety.

If you can put down the bottle long enough I'd love to hear how Pearl Harbor was a false flag, as well as why we shouldn't have stepped in from the Nazi party and Adolf Hitler taking over Europe. Lmao.

I don't understand what your point is or what your disagreeing with. I'm saying the Jewish guy was an American. Do you disagree with that?

I know how discussions with you work. I've made my points and shown you why your opinion is baseless.

Also, you never provided that evidence... which is something you love to accuse other people of doing ;)

He's trying to say that it would have been better for the Polish people if the US never entered the war and Nazi Germany stayed in power. Lmao, can't make this shit up.

It still seems to suggest poland had a choice.

How are you getting that from what I said? Poland had no choice in the matter regardless of whether the US intervened. They are squished between the two powers (Germany - Russia).

Or how would it be better for poland without the US?

I'm not saying it would've been better or worse. There fate really had nothing to do with the US intervention. One could say, the US intervention made it worse, being that it was under Soviet control after the war.

Honest question, is English not your first language?

https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/6twrqf/saving_private_ryan_is_zionist_propaganda/dlo8qnh/

Yes you do, just there is so much evidence for nazi racial beliefs.

And please tell me about lebensraum? Was this going to be abandoned?

Nice piece of evidence for you to consider, when the nazis got into ukraine they were greeted with offerings of friendship by villages. Why then (beside for racial reasons) did the nazis not utilise this ready support?