This makes a lot of sense to me. Thanks for posting, OP.

Right wing doesn't equal republican either.

I've learned that whenever someone gives you two choices the first thing you should consider is if there are other choices that weren't offered.

I don't think the point of the OP was that all people believe one of those two choices (and only one), but rather to give people a beginning point on how to understand people's opinions that otherwise seem radical and confusing (at best).

Yet in one sentence I showed them how to understand themselves.

I don't think you or anyone else is really offering much more.

Just a glimpse.

You see, what we think we know about the systems, movers and shakers is built on generational lies at this point I feel like any attempt to define some binary truth out of lies is just going to be the product of lies.

I prefer to look towards that elusive other option.

Why do leftists never talk about corporations then? They just talk about that mean thing Trump said and how he somehow meddled with the Russians even though everything he does policy wise would suggest he is not a Russian agent. Leftists don’t think corporations are behind any dehumanizing conspiracy theories, they think Trump is behind it all. And they call you a nut job if you believe any conspiracy that goes beyond what the mainstream media tells us.

Not this Leftist my friend.

Leftists existed before Trump and will exist after him. To pretend that actual leftists' beliefs revolve around Trump is crazy.

When you fight absolutism with the same.

Down with the Corporatists. Down with the Statists.

Anarchy, and specifically Anarcho-Syndicalism or Libertarian Socialism are what I advocate for! Social Democracy is just a stepping stone.

I keep telling anarchist that they aren't prepared for what they're asking for.

Very few people raised in a heavily governed society could handle anarchy. If you want shit like the KKK, the Mafia, drug Lords and Scientology to have real power then go ahead and fire up the anarchy driven society. It would last for about 50 years tops before some group like mentioned above took over completely. Then anarchy is gone and so is the Constitution. No going back.

Careful what you cash in the blood of your ancestors for.

It's not supposed to be sudden. We have to work through the national scale, and gradually devolve power back to the localities. It's about free associations and not forced ones. Anarchy doesn't mean chaos- it means radical democracy on the local level and nested associations working up to the Federal. It's not lack of government- it's justification of all hierarchical institutions, and if they can't justify their existence, they aren't legitimate.

Sorry man, you absolutely have to find a new name for what you're calling anarchy. Someone lied to you.

Anarchy

a state of disorder due to absence or nonrecognition of authority.

The no recognition part is how most anarchists behave, it's a dead end path.

radical democracy on the local level and nested associations working up to the Federal.

This sounds quite good but not at all related to anarchy. Sorry of I'm standing on a language issue but it's important we accurately use the right words for things. I've met hard core communists who call themselves anarchist but everything they describe is Communism. It's a recruiting technique.

What you're describing is very similar to a standard federation or republic.

What I describe is literally what the original anarchists had in mind...what you are reading is the text book definition, which has been intentionally twisted. I recommend reading some of the works of Rudolf Rocker, who had actual experience from the Spanish revolutions, or Noam Chomsky, who has expanded these ideas.

Your definition of anarchy is what I used to believe it meant...but the original founders of the movement never believed in complete chaos.

I recommend reading some of the works of Rudolf Rocker, who had actual experience from the Spanish revolutions

I get where your coming from but what Rudolph was experiencing is falling in love with the battlefield, a lot of vet experience that when they get home from a war. A revolution is exactly the environment that anarchy exists in, but it's not a permanent system. Anarchy is that period of time between the fall of one government and the rise of it's replacement. It will naturally go away by means of force or cooperation. On one side you get a tyranny and the other you get a government.

Rocker wrote about the Spanish syndicalists who were crushed by Franco during the civil war. Catalonia was self-ruling and organized by its working class for several years in the 1930's, but as the national government broke down and the communists guerrillas rose up all they worked for was destroyed. The Syndicalists were already a functioning aspect of Spanish society before the civil war.

Orwell was there too, before the full on civil war, and he wrote highly of the Catalonian syndicalist society.

True anarchy.

bradok, Libertarian Socialism is an oxymoron.

Unless like libertarianism, socialism denies outright the idea of listed and enforced individual human rights.

No. It's Libertarianism with a soul...with a Socially oriented end game, where power is vested in local communities but everyone works to ensure that things like quality healthcare and education are available to all. Difficult? Yes. Impossible? No. Look at Catalonian Spain pre-Franco.

It must be a system as voluntary as possible that preserves individual rights while incentivizing not coercing cooperation.

Well said.

No listed individual rights is pratically the calling card of libertarians, so no I'm not buying that statement.

In my humble opinion if one still considers either party "theirs" they are still completely unaware of the framework of "the machine". I personally have never voted for a republican in my life however the 2016 election totally opened my eyes (I strongly suspected the entire system was a sham after 2000 election) to the absolute horses*#t sideshow that is American politics it is truly a joke and anyone who roots for this team or that team is a part of the problem not the solution regardless which "side" you cheer for.

Welcome back from your Coma. To catch you up of what you have missed in the past 10 years let me quickly catch you up.

Everybody has gone Insane.

So with this comprehensive look back at how geopolitics and society has changed i think you can understand the world a little better now.

There isnt much to do anymore. Its a worldwide phenomenon.

The secret world government subsumes corporations and the government of the United States.

Satan, and his minions the Satanists and the Luciferianists, are the purveyors of all the suffering visited upon the masses. They use corporations and governments to execute their strategies.

It's not that secret, but it is a lot more subtle.

I find it amusing that people genuinely believe the market and the government of America/EU are opposed. We are constantly fed the notion that the market and the economy is some sort of deity that must be appeased with privatizations and tax breaks for corporations for the super rich, and that to do otherwise invites disaster. That has been the tune played at full volume for as long as I've been alive, and the results are what you have seen since the Reagan and Clinton era. What disagreements a particular business may have with the government are merely a matter of businesses trying to gain a competitive advantage, rather than any fundamental conflict - some oil business complains about environmental regulations, some health insurance company doesn't want to cover sick people or old people, etc. There is no deep-seated conflict between the permanent bureaucracy as a whole and the interests of business, which is why we're not hearing about the Pentagon's funding being cut or the CIA being cut. They (both Republicans and Democrats, today) do have a deep-seated conflict with the parts of the bureaucracy that were created to placate the masses, like Social Security, but only so far as they exist to help the masses survive; they don't have a problem with, for example, means-testing or bureaucratic tricks to cut people off of assistance. I believe it was one of the Austrian School guys who suggested terminating the civil rights of people on welfare, like not allowing them to vote, which tells you everything you need to know about the Austrian School.

I don't know how anyone who seriously questions the powers that be can not question the market, how they can seriously believe in something like anarcho-capitalism if they are the least bit aware of what is going on. It doesn't need to be a blind acceptance of communism or Marxism or whatever, but it should be obvious that many of the memes we're fed about the market are propaganda.

As far as the quadrennial circuses matter, they're not something worth serious investment. I thought 2016 was going to be the ultimate insult of Clinton vs. Bush, but they managed to outdo themselves with the latest debacle. I would hope most of the people here see the debacle for what it is, rather than attaching some significance to Trump (there is simply no organic support for Clinton; even the elites who backed Clinton don't want her, they just have to put up with her because of the Clinton fortune). I think a bigger issue than mere Trump supporters are out-and-out fascists who are using this platform to spread their ideology, and that really goes beyond simple political posts. I think with most Trump support, it's not about Trump the man - everyone should know he's a goddamned fool - but that Trump is a means towards their own ends, even if those ends are the feefees they get when Trump says some hi-larious racist shit.

Have to admit I got rolled up in that for awhile. However, I realized I needed to take a step back from the fray and be objective.

I am always a floating voter, and had allowed myself to get swept up in the drama. So, I exited the resistance and researched all opinions, instead. Came to the general consensus that the division is horse shit, being pedaled so as to create division rather than to heal it.

Ultimately, I discovered I am a left leaning libertarian, rather than the democratic socialist I though I was. I am now exploring all opinions and learning fat more than I ever did in the liberal echo chamber.

We are all humans and listening to other opinions should not exclude ones you don't like. If something makes you uncomfortable, it can teach you important shit about yourself.

Anyway, hope that made some sense and much love, to you all.

Personally, the way I see it. DJT can be used to win this war. He may be a puppet, but I believe the people do have the power to use him as president for good. If the people could understand the full gravity of our situation and what the forces are that are happening around us, Trump could use his platform to inform the world whats behind the curtain. IMO, Congress and the Judiciary are the real problems in govt. president is merely there for publicity and either taking blame or praise. Executive branch is only there to execute orders.

Right wing doesn't equal republican either.

It must be a system as voluntary as possible that preserves individual rights while incentivizing not coercing cooperation.

It's not that secret, but it is a lot more subtle.