Debt As A Means Of Control

1  2018-09-22 by 129321

Debt Bondage is an archaic method, during the high middle ages serfdom under feudalism was highly prevalent, and sadly, many parallels can be made from victims of days of old to debtors in the 21st century, in western society.

John Taylor illustrated the the interests of the creditor, and the debtor.

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"One interest is a tyrant, the other its slave. In Britain, one of these interests owes to the other above ten hundred millions of pound sterling, which would require twelve million slaves to discharge, at eighty pounds sterling each... If the debtor interest amounts to ten millions of souls, and would be worth forty pounds sterling round, sold for slaves, it pays twelve and a half percentum on it's capitation value, to the creditor interest... This profit for their masters, made by those who are called freemen, greatly exceeds what is generally made by those who are called slaves"

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To place someone in debt is obviously more profitable then ownership, a debtor does not need to be fed, housed, or clothed.

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The majority of Americans do not own the house they live in, they belong usually in majority to corrupt financial institutions, mortgage rates have seen a very steady increase^1, and so have interest rates for student loans.^2.

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Something terrifying to consider is that both mortgages, student loans, as well as medical debt is tied to LIBOR, as well as Euribor which are both open to manipulation by financial institutions, usually the same banks people are in debted too.

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Fascism and socialism had common roots in central economic planning and overpowering the state over the individual, the rise of the modern military industrial complex illustrates modern central economic planning in the united states, and the rise of state capitalism ^ 3

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To continue favoring central planning, and abandoning individualism will inevitably lead to the serfdom of the individual, loss of freedom, and the creation of an oppressive society.

^1http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-biz-mortgage-rates-housing-market-repercussions-20180919-story.html

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^2https://www.credible.com/blog/student-loans/student-loan-interest-rates-headed-up/

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^3https://web.archive.org/web/20121012025610/http://www.zcommunications.org/state-and-corp-by-noam-chomsky

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75 comments

Usury is the ultimate tool of the jew.

It has nothing to do with ethnicity or religion and everything to do with a human failing that we are all susceptible to: greed.

When most people use Jews in this context, they are usually using it as shorthand for Zionist Jews

These people really should be using the term Zionist then, otherwise most people are just going to assume they are being racist and not take anything they say seriously.

Zionist Jews are just pawns of the Old World Order. They were the only religion (Christianity and Islam do not approve of usury) that were okay with charging interest, and therefore, used as the group to steal the wealth from the people. They are not the most powerful but because of their positioning in this game, they have accrued a lot more power than ever expected.

You mean literally the only means of control.

Usury needs to be either outlawed or replaced. It's been proven that private banks cannot handle the responsibility of usury. Time and time again they take advantage of their customers.

No more extraction!

No more free ride!

That's why bitcoin

All bitcoin does is turn into dollars it isnt its own thing

You have a lot of learning to do

Nope. That's all it is. That's all it will ever be. I did enjoy making enough for my house down payment off the bubble though thanks to the fools that think it will ever be anything

Good for you. But you're absolutely wrong and only time will tell.

But then id be laying for both a place to live currently and saving for a house.

Instead I just pay one thing.

I get it. You dont understand basic finances and think some crypto is going to magically save you.

Its not. And my house is halfway paid off already it'll be paid off in under 5 years.

You should stop making assumptions about strangers on the interent. You dont know what the fuck youre talking about

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Bitcoin is the worst of both hard and fiat currency. Unlike most hard currencies it has no intrinsic value, unlike fiat currencies it does not have the flexibility to expand with an economy. Meaning there is a hard limit to growth and a final amount of total value possible in the system, but even less to back it up than say a gold standard.

It's a neat idea and actual block-chain based banking is likely going to be the future until quantum computing renders block-chains essentially worthless - but Bitcoin specifically will fail spectacularly.

Lol. You fool.

Bitcoin is a pyramid scheme.

It has value because the people who have hoarded it convince others that it has value.

It's the only immutable database ever invented in the world. Do you understand?

I literally could not care less.

OK. Most other people will.

Very

thanks for this

I've been debt free since 21. Such a good feeliorino.

I have zero debt. Does that mean I am one of (((them)))? I sure hope so!

"I have zero debt. Does that mean I am one of (((them)))?"

If you have to ask, you ain't. But if it's any consolation, you are Parenthetically Pathetic.

(((k)))

The scary part is that the system is now built to force people into debt! want a job? go to college! take out huge loans that you will spend decades fighting to pay off! the whole thing is engineered to get as many people into debt as possible, and its working.

a lot of people go to college and do useless degrees, that will never get them a job, but I get your point

The scary part is that there are many more people who have valuable degrees who are drastically underpaid. Eg, i know a girl with a masters degree who works in a critical government position who has calculated she will finally have paid off her loans by age 55. Thats factoring in raises.

Hell, there are people with degrees in engineering who have to work at places like Starbucks because there are not 1) enough positions and 2) the dubious skill gap.

The scary part is that the system is now built to force people into debt!

Nonsense.

want a job? go to college!

There's plenty of jobs that don't require college degrees. Many business owners also don't have degrees.

take out huge loans that you will spend decades fighting to pay off!

Unless you don't go to college.

You totally missed the point: the people running the system create this pressure and put it on people. Sure, common sense dictates you dont have to get a degree, but you are bombarded with people telling you thats what you need. And not even a 4 year degree. Think of the predatory tech schools and such.

you are bombarded with people telling you thats what you need

Any type of investment is a risk. Should 18 year olds be taking that risk? Probably not. So the blame is split between the person, their parents and their other influencers/advisors.

See, you overplayed your hand. Now you just sound like the guys running the for profit schools. Its easy to justify when its just some poor shmuck who made a bad call weighing out risk/reward. Thats as bad as a drug dealer saying "i dont make people take drugs, i just make them available". There is still responsibility there.

It sounds like you don't want to put any of the responsibility on the student nor their parents, when they should also be given part of the blame.

no, i dont, for the simple reason that people are being told this is the ONLY WAY to get to a better living. they are constantly bombarded with the idea, from school counselors to advertisements to business recruiters. Coors brewery very famously would not hire anyone unless they had a college degree, from truck drivers to janitors, for example. Entire industries tailor their claims to requiring a degree to be competitive. The parents trust that the institution isnt acting out of self interest, and they only want what they are being told is best for their child. but this is exactly it- how you get millions of people into debt to control them.

as for your other argument- lets take it out of metaphor. youre saying: ''i dont need an education loan. the bank has them, but i dont need it so i wont have any issues. people who do take out loans are going to keep taking them regardless of whether its from bank A or bank B until they decide to quit.'' Therein lies the problem. 1 person who isnt in debt is not the problem. you're the one little ant in his corner of the hive thinking that as long as you got yours the rest of the hive can get fucked. The whole point of this discussion is that there are massive groups of people who are being dragged into this under false pretenses and are unable to effectively extract themselves from it. and lets not forget! these are smart people, or at least smarter. its the intelligent ones who want to better themselves and improve their education for longterm goals. its the smart ones who go in for this to begin with! they just dont see the trap until the jaws close.

I wasted money going to college, but I take part of the blame just I blame the people who allowed me to take the loans and to the people who talked me into taking the loans.

But that’s what stupid though. You shouldn’t have to carry around that Financial burden the rest of your life because you had a decision to try to improve yourself. Doesn’t that seem backwards to you?

You shouldn’t have to carry around that Financial burden the rest of your life because you had a decision to try to improve yourself.

I won't. My student loans will be paid off. It's just going to take some time and I will have to make some sacrifices like not going out to eat multiple times a week until its paid off.

Doesn’t that seem backwards to you?

I would like to see college prices decrease. And the best way to make that happen is for the government to stop lending out so much money to people who may not be able to pay it back. The government is the most reliable person to pay back in the US and since the schools know they are going to get it, they have no problem raising prices.

I'd also like to see the schools stop allowing foreign students who 1) take spots that Americans would otherwise be taking and 2) are willing to pay more than most Americans can afford.

Paying for any sort of education PERIOD is a stupid thing for any smart civilization to do. If you’re trying to have the strongest smartest nation, why would you want to hinder anything that allows them to be the best they could be? Unless they just want a nation of idiots which is exactly what they want Americans to be. It bugs me that education is so expensive. We can learn everything for free online yet we Force ourselves into these institutions to just take all your money and then charge you $300 for books and all that other stupid nonsense. Nothing like society telling you how desperate it is in need of smart confident workers while all along the way they don’t help you at all and expect you to do everything yourself. But then they tell you you’re an excellent employer and your valuable to the company and a great asset yet not want to give you a livable wage. Such a backwards upside down loopty loop fucky world we live in. “ oh you don’t have this piece of paper therefore you must not know what you’re talking about! Hurdur!”

Well, there are two kinds of governments. One kind wants to make their people smarter. The other wants their people dumb and willing to believe everything they say.

This is almost exclusively an American problem though. How did Europe, and Canada, and Australia figure it out? It's not even exclusively American either, more like specific states.

As someone who has spent at least half my life living outside the usa, i can say it comes down to 1 basic thing: attitude. America still likes to judge the success of the nation based on the peaks acheived by the wealthy few, rather than the lows persisted upon the many. Its long been said to truely judge a nation look no further than its poor. Other countries have long made a point of trying to lift people out of poverty and giving them the means to improve themselves. America puts that responsibility on the poor themselves, and blames them for their failures.

"Quite imperceptibly the "Creditor of Kings" has become the King of Creeds, and we really cannot take this monarch's pleading for emancipation as otherwise than uncommonly naive...According to the present constitution of this world, the jew in truth is already more than emancipate: he rules, and will rule, so long as money remains the power before which all our doings and our dealings lose their force."

-Richard Wagner

Debt is a tool. Use it to your advantage.

No reason to buy a large purchase in cash if a loan interest rate is lower than the market return rate. If you buy a car or house in cash as opposed to getting a low interest rate loan you're actually losing money.

I could have bought my car outright but got a 0.9% interest loan. Why? Because the money I would have dropped on the car is invested and has averaged a ~7% return.

Also lol @ mortgage rate increases. They were in the teens 30 years ago.. We are enjoying a decade of historically low rates.

You're only participating in their game. Usury is a thing to be abolished, not continued.

Their game benefits me so I'm all for it.

Instead of working for them, you could work with "us" and have a system that doesn't enslave you.

Think bigger.

How am I enslaved, exactly?

OK, so I won't bother with the wall of text.

Have you seen [Mike Maloney's, Hidden secrets of money?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFDe5kUUyT0

or

Bill Still's Money Masters?

Sadly, the vast majority of americans are unable to make large purchases without resorting to high interest loans.

The median price of a home is around 279,000$, 1 far higher then 30 years ago. How can an individual without a stable income afford to make such a purchase?

They cannot, therefore the majority of homeowners are also college educated 2 , this means they are usually indebted from education, student loan interest rates have been reaching historical levels. 3

In a previous post I explained the issues in manipulation of LIBOR and Euribor, adjustable rate mortgages and private student loans are directly tied to LIBOR and Euribor, manipulation of this standard has been commonplace at Tier 1 Investment banks, whether your interest is high or low you are still negatively impacted.

1 https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.businessinsider.com/cost-to-buy-a-house-in-every-state-ranked-2018-8

2https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.brookings.edu/blog/the-avenue/2017/10/09/who-is-the-new-face-of-american-homeownership/amp/

3 https://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/loans/student-loans/why-student-loan-interest-rates-high/

You don't have to buy a house.

You're still enslaved if you rent. In some ways, more so.

What? How? Who has more mobility? A renter or homeowner?

While renting, you're wasting more of your working hours & income making someone else rich, while also still paying the bank, just indirectly. Also, try modifying the place you're renting, without your landlord's approval. Finally, your landlord can raise your rent every year, pricing you out over time. This is all pretty obvious to anyone with some life experience, if you ask me.

I get mobility and can move whenever I want, wherever and whenever, regardless of market conditions. I can't do that without a house. The ability to take a higher paying job at a month or two notice is invaluable.

The landlord can raise the rent to whatever the market demands. If I get priced out then I move. Doesn't seem like a difficult concept to me.

no, not moreso

how is renting equally as enslaving as debt?

that's reaching

See my other reply under previous comment. I'll add that rent payments are forever, and they can and will increase, forever. Mortgage debt has a finish line, and your monthly payments are at least stable. Giving all of your money away to make landlords rich is financially foolish.

I totally understand that logic and you’re right from a financial perspective

It could be bias because I’m renting right now. That is in part because I’m paranoid about the subject

I totally understand. Thanks for not getting defensive. I appreciate your response.

In Canada, when you become a home buyer, you get a mortgage. Which literally translates to death pledge. They can enslave individuals, enslave countries. To whom? A person, a person or persons with that much control is anti-human.

Modern day slavery. It should be destroyed.

The majority of Americans do not own the house they live in

This means they also don't have to pay maintenance on it. When my roof leaks, I pay for it. When I rent an apartment and it leaks, the landlord pays for it.

Something terrifying to consider is that both mortgages, student loans, as well as medical debt is tied to LIBOR, as well as Euribor which are both open to manipulation by financial institutions, usually the same banks people are in debted too.

No one is forced to take out any loans. People choose to.

My friend I do not mean rented homes, I am referring to any home under a mortgage, this is a crippling situation to be in, at anytime, unfortunate could put you in peril, and put you on the street

. Rented homes are even worse off, infact, many regard america as being in a “Rent Crisis” 1 most individuals renting houses live in substandard conditions, usually at constant risk of homelessness, this demonstrates postmodern serfdom very clearly.

Home foreclosures are increasingly more common 2and as I mentioned before, the vast majority of people are not in the position to avoid taking private student loans, or adjustable rate mortgages both of which are directly affected by LIBOR and Euribor.

1https://www.urban.org/urban-wire/how-solve-americas-rental-crisis-worst-case-housing-needs-grow

2 https://www.google.com/amp/s/therealdeal.com/miami/2018/07/12/property-foreclosures-across-us-are-on-the-rise-again-report/amp/

1

My friend I do not mean rented homes, I am referring to any home under a mortgage, this is a crippling situation to be in, at anytime, unfortunate consequences could put you in peril, and put you on the street

There's advantages and disadvantages to renting and buying.

Rented homes are even worse off, infact, many regard america as being in a “Rent Crisis” 1 most individuals renting houses live in substandard conditions, usually at constant risk of homelessness, this demonstrates postmodern serfdom very clearly.

No one is forced to stay in the place they chose forever. They just have to wait until the lease is up or pay an early fee to get out.

"The majority of Americans do not own the house they live in"

"This means they also don't have to pay maintenance on it. When my roof leaks, I pay for it. When I rent an apartment and it leaks, the landlord pays for it."

Brilliant.

But I have to ask, where do landlords find money to pay for such repairs?

Might the money they collect in RENT somehow factor into the scenario you've described?

On the whole, has being a "landlord" revealed itself to be a losing proposition? Are the giant corporations who own billions in residential rental properties "suckers" who are being financially "raped" by heartless greedy tenants who insist that THEY pay for leaky roofs?

Tell me more about the suffering of landlords... I have Kleenex handy.

But I have to ask, where do landlords find money to pay for such repairs?

Hopefully from the tenants, and sometimes from their own pocket when they destroy the place or don't pay.

Might the money they collect in RENT somehow factor into the scenario you've described?

Depends.

I know most people here think landlords were just given the place for free without a mortgage, but that is rarely the case. In my case, I had to buy it, then I had to put tens of thousands of dollars into it to make it livable.

I pay the mortgage off first then whatever is left is split between repairs, lawyers, improvements and savings.

A leaking roof isn't a huge problem for someone who owns an apartment building with 10-20 or more tenants. But it's a big problem for someone like me who owns a single person place.

On the whole, has being a "landlord" revealed itself to be a losing proposition?

For normal people, it really all depends on the tenant. My last tenant cost me close to $20,000 and maybe in 20 years I'll get that back from her, maybe, but that wouldn't be a huge problem for a big company.

Are the giant corporations who own billions in residential rental properties "suckers" who are being financially "raped" by heartless greedy tenants who insist that THEY pay for leaky roofs?

Most people aren't giant corporations.

Here is the problem with a lot of the arguments I see from people like you. You always think of how they will affect the 1%, not the 99%. $15 minimum wage won't kill Walmart, but it's going to kill that local coffee shop.

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If you live on the poverty line you could go into debt at any moment. All it takes is a traffic ticket for something as innocent as a burnt out tail light and because you don't have a few hundred dollars at a moments notice that ticket starts collecting late fees and the cost grows from there.

When you are car dependent you can be stopped at any moment and your ID(driver's license) demanded, which is not true for pedestrians/cyclists/public transit users. As a driver you are much more likely to have to deal with the police than nondrivers and are more likely to break the law without realizing it. Sometimes I wonder if these are reasons for keeping most of the US car dependent and making it more difficult to live without a drivers license. As a nondriver I do not need to carry any ID on my person. Of course with the political climate and the trend towards authoritarianism that could change, just de facto mandating ID because it is difficult to live without it is doing the job to keep most US citizens under control.

Just to remaind all of you the Hebrew bible, [the five books of moses] forbid usury, and God explains this by saying, 'because the jews should be slaves only to me', I.E debt=slavery.

The scary part is that there are many more people who have valuable degrees who are drastically underpaid. Eg, i know a girl with a masters degree who works in a critical government position who has calculated she will finally have paid off her loans by age 55. Thats factoring in raises.

I wasted money going to college, but I take part of the blame just I blame the people who allowed me to take the loans and to the people who talked me into taking the loans.

While renting, you're wasting more of your working hours & income making someone else rich, while also still paying the bank, just indirectly. Also, try modifying the place you're renting, without your landlord's approval. Finally, your landlord can raise your rent every year, pricing you out over time. This is all pretty obvious to anyone with some life experience, if you ask me.