“ [Lewis Tyson and Richard Kahn] argue that the lizards may be allegorical, a Swiftian satire intended to demonstrate the emergence of a global fascist state. In Children of the Matrix, Icke writes that, that if the reptilians did not exist, we would have to invent them. ‘In fact,’ he says, ‘we probably have. They are other levels of ourselves putting ourselves in our face.’ He argues, ‘We are the reptilians and the "demons" and, at the same time, we are those they manipulate because we are all the same "I".’ Lewis and Kahn make use of Douglas Kellner's distinction in Media Spectacle (1995) between a reactionary clinical paranoia, a mindset dissociated from reality, and a positive, progressive, critical paranoia, which uses the culture of suspicion to question and confront power. They argue that Icke displays elements of both, writing that what they call his 'postmodern metanarrative' may be politically empowering, a way of giving ordinary people a narrative structure with which to question what they see around them. ” - Source (sic)
well, the majority of UFO's aren't extraterrestrials. But some of them are. The only reason I believe this is from the testimony of numerous government/military/NASA personnel over the years. But on all other counts I agree with you :)
Ok, I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say you don't think UFOs are extraterrestrials. If all your saying is that UFOs are government aircraft, than I agree with you 100%. Most of them are. But if by that you are also implying that aliens from other planets haven't visited us, and that space craft of alien origin don't exist, than I have a couple of videos of my own that might change your mind. Testimony from military personnel:
It sends people to prison and even to their deaths all the time. It doesn't always work, in fact innocents are put to death based on false testimony all the time. But sometimes no hard evidence can be found, in fact sometimes no evidence can EVER be found, even though a crime has in fact taken place. Sometimes all you have to go on is witness testimony.
Our justice system using it is hardly a feather in it's cap. My magic 8-ball gets better results.
It sends people to prison and even to their deaths all the time.
Yes and that has worked out so well...
_ Eyewitness identification evidence is the leading cause of wrongful conviction in the United States. Of the more than 200 people exonerated by way of DNA evidence in the US, over 75% were wrongfully convicted on the basis of erroneous eyewitness identification evidence.source
_
Sometimes witness testimony DOES count for something. Your statistic stated that 75% percent were wrongly convicted, not 100%.
Maybe the government is just that good. They have done such a good job at hiding actual evidence that the only thing we have is witness testimony. Now I am hardly a math expert by any means, but I think that based on your statistic, it is possible that a small percentage of those witness are telling the truth
Sometimes witness testimony DOES count for something. Your statistic stated that 75% percent were wrongly convicted, not 100%.
No, No No, dude learn to read. 75 percent of the wrongly convicted were convicted because of eyewitness testimony. The other 25 percent didn't represent accurate eyewitness testimony, they represented wrongful convictions for other reasons.
Maybe the government is just that good. They have done such a good job at hiding actual evidence that the only thing we have is witness testimony.
They have long established track record to the contrary.
Now I am hardly a math expert by any means,
Obviously not. Stay away from english too.
but I think that based on your statistic, it is possible that a small percentage of those witness are telling the truth
Hey what do you know, I did read it wrong. Imagine me of all people doing that! (incase you havn't noticed already I have a tendency to overlook small, or sometimes large details. Gets me into trouble in real life too :p)
Ok ok. So maybe the government, or at least what we would call "our" government, is in fact really bad at hiding secrets. I won't deny that for a second. Maybe what I should have said, is that the "secret" or "black" government are the ones who have done such a good job at hiding this information. Now as to whether or a not a "black" government actually exists, is up for debate in an empirical sense as well.
Well this conversation is basically going nowhere :p I still believe that aliens have visited us, and you still have perfectly logical reasons to believe elsewise. This is starting to sound a lot like the God debate. It just so happens that I do believe in God as well as Aliens. So just out of curiosity, not looking for an argument here or anything as I am done debating :p, but do you believe in God or no?
Maybe what I should have said, is that the "secret" or "black" government are the ones who have done such a good job at hiding this information.
So now you're creating an imaginary government without all the flaws we currently know about government. Moving the goal post doesn't begin to describe that.
So just out of curiosity, not looking for an argument here or anything as I am done debating :p, but do you believe in God or no?
Interesting you should ask. In the strictest sense, no. I consider the chances of a Christian anthropomorphic god so unlikely as to not even be considered. Same with most of popular theologies. I do however accept the possibilities that higher forms of life might exist, and might even be likely. The chances of a being creating the universe, however, seem far less likely than it occurring from natural phenomenon. And much like I have no interest or ability to communicate with an ant, a higher species would very likely be unable or uninterested in interaction with, let alone demanding worship by, a lower form of life. And no accepting that possibility doesn't mean I think UFO phenomenon are any more likely to be natural phenomenon either. Accepting you don't know shit doesn't mean you get to start making shit up to fill the holes.
Woah now, I didn't make up the idea of a secret government by a long shot. Maybe you've heard of the Illuminati, New World Order, etc? I didn't come up with this stuff.
I believe in God, but similar to you I don't view God as an actual being, at least not in the normal sense. I don't think some giant dude in the sky with a beard just one day decided, fuck it, I want to create life!
God is simply love and acceptance of all things. In a sense god is simply a feeling that everyone holds in their hearts, in one way or another. But if you want to get into what god actually IS, I believe it has much to do with other dimensions/planes of existence, and is therefore something that we as simple humans could never understand, atleast while we remain on this plane of existence.
Hundreds of military/government personnel and scientists have attested to their knowledge of a government cover-up of alien contact over the past 50+ years. It is statically very possible that some of those people were telling the truth.
Hundreds of military/government personnel and scientists
First of all.. hundreds? Source? And...
have attested to their knowledge of a government cover-up of alien contact over the past 50+ years.
Even if it IS hundreds attesting, you flat out lie when you say 'cover-up of alien contact'. At most hundreds of people have seen weird shit, with varied opinions on the source of the anomalies, and none of whom have provided any physical evidence.
It is statically very possible that some of those people were telling the truth.
Telling the truth about what they saw? Yes. Able to accurately attribute said phenomenon to the non-terrestrial? Most certainly not. Its a pretty basic example of confirmation bias.
My source is the first video I posted entitled "the disclosure project". This is a collection of interviews of military personnel edited down from literally hundreds of different interviews. These were all interviews from the year 2001 alone. Military personnel from as far back as the 1950's, such as Major Donald Keyhoe, have publicly stated their belief in alien contact.
You are definitely right about confirmation bias though, as this could be used to explain many of the claims. But than many of these claimed sightings of alien craft and even contact with alien beings are described in great detail. These aren't just the odd sightings of a moving light up in the sky. I don't know the exact science behind confirmation bias, but I would guesstimate that a highly detailed claim would make a story less likely to be attributable to C.B. Of course these people could have just been dreaming/hallucinating, or just plain lying of course. But than maybe they weren't.
Hundreds of people interacted with aliens and not one, not a single one, has a single physical artifact? That is patently absurd. These arguments from authority are based on random phenomenon observed in the sky, or rumor, or conjecture, or the least likely - dreaming/hallucination. The interpretations drawn are classic confirmation bias. If they had real hands on experience at least one of them would have something physical to show for it.
Have you watched the video "the disclosure project"? It's in one of the links in my previous posts in this thread. These claims from the military sound pretty far removed from a simple phenomenon in the sky.
As for evidence, I believe there are groups of influential people in our society that will do everything in their power to hide any sort of physical evidence relating to alien visitation, and they do a damn good job of hiding it. The reason they have such a tight lock on alien technology? Well, I believe it has something to do with zero-point energy. More specifically, it has a whole lot to do with the fact that the revelation of functional zero-point energy technology would make the fossil fuel industry go out of business over-night.
It is the criminals, nay, the scum of this earth, who own the fossil fuel industries, these are the ones who are behind the alien cover-up. Who else would have enough money and resources to pull such a thick sheet of wool over our eyes? The government certainly doesn't.
It's not just alien technology they're hiding either. This goes all the way back to famed inventor Nikola Tesla. He was actually the first person to create a functional zero-point energy device, all the way back in the mid 1880s! His technology, and that of other inventors have been subdued and hidden by the oil industry throughout history. Look up an inventor named Adam Trombly, founder of Project Earth, for a more recent example of this cover-up. I know that you definitely won't believe any of this. But maybe someone else reading this will take a look and decide to do some of their own research...
You don't gotta be rude, I'm just trying to help expose some of the wrongdoings in our society...If you decide you want to learn something more than you should read this interview with Adam Trombly (an inventor of zero point energy systems):
alex jones does not believe arabs control hollywood you Disinfo spreader.
Alex jones is the fairest most credible journalist out there. Yes he makes mistakes hes HUMAn but he does not think ARABS control or own hollywood, arabs do own a lot of hard assets like movie studios and the empire state building, is that a conspircy?
dude, UFOs are definitly part man made part Extra terrestrial, I know that some of you would like to believe that the entire ET thing is 100% distraction from the real NWO banking oligarchy issues that are more tangible, but Im sorry there are too many credible NASA UFO videos from ORBIT of craft flying around at 200,000MPH that cannot, I repeat CANNOT be soley human in origin. These UFOs are sometimes backengineered, and just accept the fact that there are ETs and yes theve been here for a while but no I dont have any evidence that they have controlled or influenced Earth Politics but with all the ancient astronaut history its hard to believe ETs havent been here a looong long time.
If they are real they wouldnt have ONLY shown up in the last 100 years, and they also would have not been able to not contact at least some humans who of course noone would believe
Let's think this through. Proof that NASA landed men on the Moon in '69 - if untrue, Russia would present humiliating proof of the fakery. Since there was no Russian (or other county) public proof or claims, no more reason to doubt.
Possibilities:
- Successful landing, nothing to see here.
- NASA very adeptly faked it, Russia was fooled as well
- Faked, Russia is wise to the scam, but lacks adequate proof.
- Faked, Russia has the proof. Makes a sweet deal in exchange for silence.
-Faked, Russia can prove, but diplomacy prevails and Russia avoids any tit-for-tat publicity.
Precedence:
Russia has a history of secret launches and astronaut deaths, since proven, that the US never made public but certainly knew about.
China's Shezhou 7 spacewalk in '08 was certainly faked, while NASA stayed silent.
Two things for me that prove the landing wasn't fake:
1: There's corner reflectors up there.
2: The number of people involved would mean someone would leak information.
I also think the video's were faked. Why?
Well, maybe the radiation bleached the film while they were up there, so they had to re-shoot the scenes back on earth otherwise it would be a massive embarrassment to America... first man on the moon, but no film to show for it!
I was a skeptic of 9/11 for a long time. I still might be but am leaning in the direction of the government feeding us logical explanations instead of hard facts.
Building #7 really doesn't sit right with me. Maybe everything was the way it's been told, but building 7... collapsing suddenly. It doesn't make sense from the point of view of random structural weakness...
the real question is why we went back and never told anyone, or about the bases and structures and craft chillin in craters that were there before we got there http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkxOzsVk6bU&feature=related Alex Collier shows us the structures hidden on the dark side of the moon (photos from Apollo 13)
Thanks for the link as I happened to be scouring for videos to watch.
I've been awake since 1991. Also the truth movement has been happening for thousands of years. It's not something that is associated solely with 9/11. That is a mainstream media thing.
I dont believe the men behind the curtains have as much power as most of us "conspiracy theorists" think. I believe they are a few men sort of riding the wave of distraction and forgetting that has been known to occur in this era since ancient times. They are doing what they can to help it forward but they are not the cause. it is natural in the evolution of humanity. there will be a time when people see truth much more than our societies today.
I believe in science and documented history. The earth is making a massive change, I don't think there's a fucking thing we can do about it, except to like living in a warmer climate.
Al Qaeida jihadists planned a terrorist strike upon the USA on September 11th, 2001 hijacking and flying 4 planes into prominent buildings. Years of planning from Afghanistan, pilots who could barely handle Cessnas - thus ready to fly 757's, while evading expected intercepting fighters, cause 3 steel-reinforced concrete towers to collapse after hitting 2 of them, leaving no trace of a plane at the Pentagon, evade FBI & military scrutiny the entire time, and bring prosperity to their people - sorrow to the USA.
that jesus christ was a real person(being an allegory for the sun, along with all the other saviors that die on crosses for 3 days,) that the world is run by 'the people' in a free and democratic fashion
uh, yeah, all that stuff about Jesus is completely fabricated. Acharya S, who pulls it all out of nowhere without basis, is the one cited for most of it, but she's actually just a ripoff of Gerald Massey, who academics have long since refused to take seriously. You're welcome to try and find proof to the contrary; this guy even offers $1000 to anyone who can do it. But you can't do it. The parallels are fabricated.
When any of the so-called members of the Order are quoted as mentioning it what they are in fact referring to is a stronger form of international law and a reduction in the anarchy of the international order.
It has nothing whatsoever to do with a global dictatorship.
We have much more to fear by the actions of corporations in a lawless global order that we do in a system that enforces a system of international law.
If you can convince me that an almost total lack of enforcement of international law is in some way preferable to the progressive development of a system of law that holds States and corporations accountable, then by all means I will agree that a more stringent international body could aid the expansion of corporate control.
Its being created RIGHT NOW, it IS the G20 etc etc, that WILL be the global bank that creates LAWS a MERGER of these forces into a legitimate government, enforcing bogus copenhagen treaty environmetal capntrade laws
When you are in a place of power... information is the key. The easiest thing to do is to pay great attention to that which will further your cause and carefully ignore that which might take away from your cause which you can then claim ignorance from.
"Who would have guessed that X would happen???" is the common statement by people who have passively or even actively made room for X to happen. No conspiracy is needed with malicious ignorance.
I think it is much more indirect then this. they know that we will do this to ourselves as long as they keep the truth from us. its sort of like the people in power are following a wave of distraction thats been known to take over in this era.
They know that in the evolution of our species there is an obvious pattern. The longer we are around, the more distracted we are from being our true selves. working/evolving with each other and nature for causes that do not involve killing ourselves.
These distractions, naturally caused by human nature and technology, also causes this "ignorance is bliss" thing. People eat, drink, and smoke terrible things without question. This same concept seems to be everywhere, not just consumption.
So, throughout history these people have used this knowledge to help push these ideas subtly (our terrible educational systems, injected meats and foods, wars, diseases, etc) . Thus, "indirectly" reducing the population through covert means.
I have no idea what is coming next,. I just know that by acknowledging these things and separating my thoughts from other peoples ideas, I am a little more prepared than most people
you may be correct, let's say probably, but what (externally identifiable) things cause you to think this ? There must be something as you have just made an unqualified assertion, and you are sane.
The conspiracy theory that says that humans came from monkeys and that we are in fact primates! Listen people, the only science teacher you'll ever need is Pastor Dave from That 70's Show, end of story.
Can you honestly believe we are the only sentient and aware life forms in an infinite universe?
Really? How can you possibly know? You're 1 person on this planet, with ZERO relevant knowledge and information on the subject but you know for sure. No, the internet does not count toward that knowledge.....
I mean, its your opinion.....that's fine....have an opinion......but why have such a staunch opinion on something you can know nothing about???
Would it not be better to say something like, "I believe we are alone, but am open to the possibility that my current knowledge and information is limited and I am not likely to know for sure if that is true or not and could proven wrong at any moment."
But you don't say such a thing which just simply means you don't want to think about the possibility? Am I right?
So when people video lights and UFO's and the military records these things as well....its all just mass hysteria? Its all in people's heads?
When that Brit hacked NASA and found a document on their system labeled "Non-terrestrial Officers" you know its just for funsies? Its a gag? What is more likely?
How can you come to that conclusion? Again, without any real information one way or another other than the obvious stuff we see on the net and TV.....how can you write that possibility off? Can you know for sure?
Also what is with the down votes? No response, just.....NOPE, YOU'RE WRONG?? Who knows better here? If you know better why not tell us how? Afraid?
Some of them are hoaxes by people who like to engineer hoaxes. The rest have natural explanations or are tests of new military aircraft or weapon systems.
When that Brit hacked NASA and found a document on their system labeled "Non-terrestrial Officers" you know its just for funsies? Its a gag? What is more likely?
Well, it /could/ have been a security "honeypot". I don't deny that he saw what he though.
This extreme numerical over-representation of Jews among the senior administrators of the Ivy League colleges and universities cannot be explained away as a coincidence or as the result of mere random chance. You must ask yourself how such an incredibly small and extremely unrepresentative minority ethnic group that only represents 2% of the American population could so completely dominate the administration of America's leading colleges and universities.
I have asked myself this question, and the conclusion I have come to is that the Jews are over-represented in the fields of academia, various sciences, finance, media, information technology etc., because they are:
studious
often of extremely high intelligence
driven by culture and family to achieve in these fields (the best revenge is to live well)
greedHHHHH fiscally astute
nepotistic, tribal, conspiratorial?
and so on
Perhaps that is a stereotype, but if you've taken a look at the kabbalah and other jewish religious teachings, you'd see that they are extremely complex and require years of deep study and research. Much like the hindu religion(s), studying this shit requires a lot of hard work and brainpower, and makes you a smarter and more capable adult than the average TV-raised dumbed down westerner.
Maybe I'm stereotyping but I've spent years looking into this stuff and have yet to be convinced that the Jewish World Conspiracy theory is more compelling that the Diverse Rich Fuckers World Conspiracy theory (a theory that allows for over-representation of Jews amongst the Diverse Rich Fuckers, due to reason outlined above).
And it's not through lack of research or ignorance... I've told you before I've read much of TIU and listened to lots of their podcasts etc. I've seen everything on WRH and listened to everything Texe Marrs has put out. I've lurked stormfront and just finished reading On the Jews and Their Lies by Martin Luther.
I'm not convinced, and despite the recent rise in postings to this subreddit regarding the Jewish World Conspiracy, I don't think many of us here are convinced either.
At the moment though I am quite sober as it is only midday here. If anything I've had way too much coffee this morning.
I agree with the whole nepotism/tribalism thing, it is quite obvious, and it supports what I've said above. It doesn't support the overall One World Jewish Order conspiracy theory (well, that theory necessitates a Jew Hive Mind with a singular objective I suppose).
As for thinking Jews are somehow better/smarter me, I would never do such a thing. There's only a handful of people in the world I consider smarter than myself :)
Asians do the nepotism thing too. I think the Japanese are notorious for this, but my friends tell me the Chinese are becoming this way too. The Jews have a much older and established base within the annals of power, finance etc... maybe in 20 years we'll be talking about the Chinese World Order conspiracy theory?
yes you are, because there are too many jews in high places, its unproportional and they also just hire each other like a sort of affirmative action. White christian male power structure is also not fair but this IS america buddy.
WOlfowitz, kagan, pearl, hank paulson, tim gietner, bernacke, all of the homeland security cheifs, fuck these people, they arent even real jews they are just all zionists,
i am jewish and these people make me ashamed, i dont consider them my people they are some bastard race of pyschopahic killers who hiude behind isreal
ya its sucks and makes you look "antisemitic" (which means ANTI PALESTINIAN BTW) but its so true and tiotaly not fair that one group of peopel in a quasi religeioon/ethnicity/nationality can have that much power, maybe in israel but not america, we need more diveristy.n How about a Buddhist federal reserve president?
Of course that's true! Oswald was a sentient extra-terrestrial able to bend time and space to allow a single bullet to go through all the exit wounds and ricocheting in the motorcade. It all makes sense, sheeple!
What "magic" bullet? Shot lines up perfectly (see my above link). Everybody just assumes Connelly was sitting directly in front of JFK. When in fact he was sitting slightly to the left, a little lower, and had his body turned. Once when you take into account all these factors, the shot lines up perfectly in a straight line.
You don't seem to have studied it very closely. Why did all the people run up the grassy knoll toward where they thought the shot came from? Why was his body mutilated and stolen?
That's because he doesn't need to. Oh and it wasn't a straight line. Even public school textbooks show that it wasn't a straight line, hence the magic bullet theory.
New World Order (you may not like it one bit, but a one world government would go a long way to making this planet a better place, the benefits vastly outweigh the cons)
The conspiracies that say stuff is going to happen on Dec. 21, 2012 are though...
PS. Just to clarify... The NWO actually IS a conspiracy, and it actually IS real. I just used it to point out that the people who rail against it, haven't really thought it out that thoroughly...
110 comments
40 coldxrain 2010-07-31
Reptilians
6 majikpencil 2010-07-31
“ [Lewis Tyson and Richard Kahn] argue that the lizards may be allegorical, a Swiftian satire intended to demonstrate the emergence of a global fascist state. In Children of the Matrix, Icke writes that, that if the reptilians did not exist, we would have to invent them. ‘In fact,’ he says, ‘we probably have. They are other levels of ourselves putting ourselves in our face.’ He argues, ‘We are the reptilians and the "demons" and, at the same time, we are those they manipulate because we are all the same "I".’ Lewis and Kahn make use of Douglas Kellner's distinction in Media Spectacle (1995) between a reactionary clinical paranoia, a mindset dissociated from reality, and a positive, progressive, critical paranoia, which uses the culture of suspicion to question and confront power. They argue that Icke displays elements of both, writing that what they call his 'postmodern metanarrative' may be politically empowering, a way of giving ordinary people a narrative structure with which to question what they see around them. ” - Source (sic)
0 Gr4mp5 2010-07-31
Your lizard brain sez different... snort some Ebene and ask it why.
0 eugene_spencer 2010-07-31
This is the most damaging "conspiracy" out there.
32 docsiv 2010-07-31
That 9/11 was a terrorist plot, pulled off by 11 muslim men.
19 [deleted] 2010-07-31
The moon is a holographic space station.
2 eugene_spencer 2010-07-31
I really wish it were true though.
14 [deleted] 2010-07-31
[deleted]
2 narf760 2010-07-31
well, the majority of UFO's aren't extraterrestrials. But some of them are. The only reason I believe this is from the testimony of numerous government/military/NASA personnel over the years. But on all other counts I agree with you :)
0 GavriloPrincep 2010-07-31
a problem with "UFOs are extraterrestrials" is the huge number of sightings ( | (that is "given") the size and distances involved).
There may be other problems : I don't dedicate my cpu cycles to thinking about UFOs - though big ups to those who do.
0 [deleted] 2010-07-31
[deleted]
1 narf760 2010-07-31
Ok, I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say you don't think UFOs are extraterrestrials. If all your saying is that UFOs are government aircraft, than I agree with you 100%. Most of them are. But if by that you are also implying that aliens from other planets haven't visited us, and that space craft of alien origin don't exist, than I have a couple of videos of my own that might change your mind. Testimony from military personnel:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-347563032617886106&hl=en&emb=1#
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6552475158249898710#
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5W_3aneRPOg
1 harsesus 2010-07-31
Argument from authority.
1 narf760 2010-07-31
It sends people to prison and even to their deaths all the time. It doesn't always work, in fact innocents are put to death based on false testimony all the time. But sometimes no hard evidence can be found, in fact sometimes no evidence can EVER be found, even though a crime has in fact taken place. Sometimes all you have to go on is witness testimony.
1 harsesus 2010-07-31
Our justice system using it is hardly a feather in it's cap. My magic 8-ball gets better results.
Yes and that has worked out so well...
_
Eyewitness identification evidence is the leading cause of wrongful conviction in the United States. Of the more than 200 people exonerated by way of DNA evidence in the US, over 75% were wrongfully convicted on the basis of erroneous eyewitness identification evidence. source
_
Obviously, it pretty much never works.
FTFY
2 narf760 2010-07-31
Sometimes witness testimony DOES count for something. Your statistic stated that 75% percent were wrongly convicted, not 100%.
Maybe the government is just that good. They have done such a good job at hiding actual evidence that the only thing we have is witness testimony. Now I am hardly a math expert by any means, but I think that based on your statistic, it is possible that a small percentage of those witness are telling the truth
1 harsesus 2010-07-31
No, No No, dude learn to read. 75 percent of the wrongly convicted were convicted because of eyewitness testimony. The other 25 percent didn't represent accurate eyewitness testimony, they represented wrongful convictions for other reasons.
They have long established track record to the contrary.
Obviously not. Stay away from english too.
They said nothing of the sort.
2 narf760 2010-07-31
Hey what do you know, I did read it wrong. Imagine me of all people doing that! (incase you havn't noticed already I have a tendency to overlook small, or sometimes large details. Gets me into trouble in real life too :p)
Ok ok. So maybe the government, or at least what we would call "our" government, is in fact really bad at hiding secrets. I won't deny that for a second. Maybe what I should have said, is that the "secret" or "black" government are the ones who have done such a good job at hiding this information. Now as to whether or a not a "black" government actually exists, is up for debate in an empirical sense as well.
Well this conversation is basically going nowhere :p I still believe that aliens have visited us, and you still have perfectly logical reasons to believe elsewise. This is starting to sound a lot like the God debate. It just so happens that I do believe in God as well as Aliens. So just out of curiosity, not looking for an argument here or anything as I am done debating :p, but do you believe in God or no?
1 harsesus 2010-07-31
So now you're creating an imaginary government without all the flaws we currently know about government. Moving the goal post doesn't begin to describe that.
Interesting you should ask. In the strictest sense, no. I consider the chances of a Christian anthropomorphic god so unlikely as to not even be considered. Same with most of popular theologies. I do however accept the possibilities that higher forms of life might exist, and might even be likely. The chances of a being creating the universe, however, seem far less likely than it occurring from natural phenomenon. And much like I have no interest or ability to communicate with an ant, a higher species would very likely be unable or uninterested in interaction with, let alone demanding worship by, a lower form of life. And no accepting that possibility doesn't mean I think UFO phenomenon are any more likely to be natural phenomenon either. Accepting you don't know shit doesn't mean you get to start making shit up to fill the holes.
0 narf760 2010-07-31
Woah now, I didn't make up the idea of a secret government by a long shot. Maybe you've heard of the Illuminati, New World Order, etc? I didn't come up with this stuff.
I believe in God, but similar to you I don't view God as an actual being, at least not in the normal sense. I don't think some giant dude in the sky with a beard just one day decided, fuck it, I want to create life!
God is simply love and acceptance of all things. In a sense god is simply a feeling that everyone holds in their hearts, in one way or another. But if you want to get into what god actually IS, I believe it has much to do with other dimensions/planes of existence, and is therefore something that we as simple humans could never understand, atleast while we remain on this plane of existence.
1 narf760 2010-07-31
Hundreds of military/government personnel and scientists have attested to their knowledge of a government cover-up of alien contact over the past 50+ years. It is statically very possible that some of those people were telling the truth.
0 harsesus 2010-07-31
First of all.. hundreds? Source? And...
Even if it IS hundreds attesting, you flat out lie when you say 'cover-up of alien contact'. At most hundreds of people have seen weird shit, with varied opinions on the source of the anomalies, and none of whom have provided any physical evidence.
Telling the truth about what they saw? Yes. Able to accurately attribute said phenomenon to the non-terrestrial? Most certainly not. Its a pretty basic example of confirmation bias.
3 narf760 2010-07-31
My source is the first video I posted entitled "the disclosure project". This is a collection of interviews of military personnel edited down from literally hundreds of different interviews. These were all interviews from the year 2001 alone. Military personnel from as far back as the 1950's, such as Major Donald Keyhoe, have publicly stated their belief in alien contact.
You are definitely right about confirmation bias though, as this could be used to explain many of the claims. But than many of these claimed sightings of alien craft and even contact with alien beings are described in great detail. These aren't just the odd sightings of a moving light up in the sky. I don't know the exact science behind confirmation bias, but I would guesstimate that a highly detailed claim would make a story less likely to be attributable to C.B. Of course these people could have just been dreaming/hallucinating, or just plain lying of course. But than maybe they weren't.
1 harsesus 2010-07-31
Hundreds of people interacted with aliens and not one, not a single one, has a single physical artifact? That is patently absurd. These arguments from authority are based on random phenomenon observed in the sky, or rumor, or conjecture, or the least likely - dreaming/hallucination. The interpretations drawn are classic confirmation bias. If they had real hands on experience at least one of them would have something physical to show for it.
0 narf760 2010-07-31
Have you watched the video "the disclosure project"? It's in one of the links in my previous posts in this thread. These claims from the military sound pretty far removed from a simple phenomenon in the sky.
As for evidence, I believe there are groups of influential people in our society that will do everything in their power to hide any sort of physical evidence relating to alien visitation, and they do a damn good job of hiding it. The reason they have such a tight lock on alien technology? Well, I believe it has something to do with zero-point energy. More specifically, it has a whole lot to do with the fact that the revelation of functional zero-point energy technology would make the fossil fuel industry go out of business over-night.
It is the criminals, nay, the scum of this earth, who own the fossil fuel industries, these are the ones who are behind the alien cover-up. Who else would have enough money and resources to pull such a thick sheet of wool over our eyes? The government certainly doesn't.
It's not just alien technology they're hiding either. This goes all the way back to famed inventor Nikola Tesla. He was actually the first person to create a functional zero-point energy device, all the way back in the mid 1880s! His technology, and that of other inventors have been subdued and hidden by the oil industry throughout history. Look up an inventor named Adam Trombly, founder of Project Earth, for a more recent example of this cover-up. I know that you definitely won't believe any of this. But maybe someone else reading this will take a look and decide to do some of their own research...
1 harsesus 2010-07-31
/facepalm
1 narf760 2010-07-31
You don't gotta be rude, I'm just trying to help expose some of the wrongdoings in our society...If you decide you want to learn something more than you should read this interview with Adam Trombly (an inventor of zero point energy systems):
http://www.spiritofmaat.com/archive/feb2/trombly.htm
-1 ackza 2010-07-31
alex jones does not believe arabs control hollywood you Disinfo spreader.
Alex jones is the fairest most credible journalist out there. Yes he makes mistakes hes HUMAn but he does not think ARABS control or own hollywood, arabs do own a lot of hard assets like movie studios and the empire state building, is that a conspircy?
-3 ackza 2010-07-31
dude, UFOs are definitly part man made part Extra terrestrial, I know that some of you would like to believe that the entire ET thing is 100% distraction from the real NWO banking oligarchy issues that are more tangible, but Im sorry there are too many credible NASA UFO videos from ORBIT of craft flying around at 200,000MPH that cannot, I repeat CANNOT be soley human in origin. These UFOs are sometimes backengineered, and just accept the fact that there are ETs and yes theve been here for a while but no I dont have any evidence that they have controlled or influenced Earth Politics but with all the ancient astronaut history its hard to believe ETs havent been here a looong long time.
If they are real they wouldnt have ONLY shown up in the last 100 years, and they also would have not been able to not contact at least some humans who of course noone would believe
-1 cometparty 2010-07-31
Go to school or something. God damn. You are really fucking incoherent.
-5 cometparty 2010-07-31
Oh come on. The Moon landing thing is just so obvious.
7 coldxrain 2010-07-31
the one thing that i say to people who doubt the moon landing is that the russians never called us out on it.
3 mca592 2010-07-31
Let's think this through. Proof that NASA landed men on the Moon in '69 - if untrue, Russia would present humiliating proof of the fakery. Since there was no Russian (or other county) public proof or claims, no more reason to doubt. Possibilities: - Successful landing, nothing to see here. - NASA very adeptly faked it, Russia was fooled as well - Faked, Russia is wise to the scam, but lacks adequate proof. - Faked, Russia has the proof. Makes a sweet deal in exchange for silence. -Faked, Russia can prove, but diplomacy prevails and Russia avoids any tit-for-tat publicity.
Precedence: Russia has a history of secret launches and astronaut deaths, since proven, that the US never made public but certainly knew about.
China's Shezhou 7 spacewalk in '08 was certainly faked, while NASA stayed silent.
1 SarahC 2010-07-31
http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/cvy42/rconspiracy_what_are_some_conspiracy_theories/c0vprbu
3 SarahC 2010-07-31
Two things for me that prove the landing wasn't fake:
1: There's corner reflectors up there.
2: The number of people involved would mean someone would leak information.
I also think the video's were faked. Why?
Well, maybe the radiation bleached the film while they were up there, so they had to re-shoot the scenes back on earth otherwise it would be a massive embarrassment to America... first man on the moon, but no film to show for it!
2 [deleted] 2010-07-31
[deleted]
1 SarahC 2010-07-31
http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/cvy42/rconspiracy_what_are_some_conspiracy_theories/c0vprbu
-2 Saucefire 2010-07-31
Wake up, sheeple.
1 cometparty 2010-07-31
What's the point in saying that?
1 anikas88 2010-07-31
satire?
1 cometparty 2010-07-31
Appeal to ridicule fallacy.
6 reeksofhavoc 2010-07-31
That we are reptilians or aliens of some sort.
That the U.S. never went to the moon.
I was a skeptic of 9/11 for a long time. I still might be but am leaning in the direction of the government feeding us logical explanations instead of hard facts.
2 SarahC 2010-07-31
Building #7 really doesn't sit right with me. Maybe everything was the way it's been told, but building 7... collapsing suddenly. It doesn't make sense from the point of view of random structural weakness...
1 ackza 2010-07-31
the real question is why we went back and never told anyone, or about the bases and structures and craft chillin in craters that were there before we got there http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkxOzsVk6bU&feature=related Alex Collier shows us the structures hidden on the dark side of the moon (photos from Apollo 13)
6 Vaux 2010-07-31
He lost me at "gravity is made by the suns rays" or something along those lines.
0 [deleted] 2010-07-31
[deleted]
3 reeksofhavoc 2010-07-31
Thanks for the link as I happened to be scouring for videos to watch.
I've been awake since 1991. Also the truth movement has been happening for thousands of years. It's not something that is associated solely with 9/11. That is a mainstream media thing.
6 jayisthedank 2010-07-31
I dont believe the men behind the curtains have as much power as most of us "conspiracy theorists" think. I believe they are a few men sort of riding the wave of distraction and forgetting that has been known to occur in this era since ancient times. They are doing what they can to help it forward but they are not the cause. it is natural in the evolution of humanity. there will be a time when people see truth much more than our societies today.
EDIT: than
-1 cometparty 2010-07-31
The word is "than", not "then".
4 xandercruise 2010-07-31
global warming
0 cometparty 2010-07-31
You don't believe it's a conspiracy? Neither do I.
1 docsiv 2010-07-31
Or you don't believe in global climate change?
1 ackza 2010-07-31
how do you "believe" in the fucking weather?..... ....-.-
1 docsiv 2010-07-31
I believe in science and documented history. The earth is making a massive change, I don't think there's a fucking thing we can do about it, except to like living in a warmer climate.
3 abasi 2010-07-31
3 mca592 2010-07-31
Al Qaeida jihadists planned a terrorist strike upon the USA on September 11th, 2001 hijacking and flying 4 planes into prominent buildings. Years of planning from Afghanistan, pilots who could barely handle Cessnas - thus ready to fly 757's, while evading expected intercepting fighters, cause 3 steel-reinforced concrete towers to collapse after hitting 2 of them, leaving no trace of a plane at the Pentagon, evade FBI & military scrutiny the entire time, and bring prosperity to their people - sorrow to the USA.
3 thereisnosuchthing 2010-07-31
that jesus christ was a real person(being an allegory for the sun, along with all the other saviors that die on crosses for 3 days,) that the world is run by 'the people' in a free and democratic fashion
1 aphemix 2010-07-31
uh, yeah, all that stuff about Jesus is completely fabricated. Acharya S, who pulls it all out of nowhere without basis, is the one cited for most of it, but she's actually just a ripoff of Gerald Massey, who academics have long since refused to take seriously. You're welcome to try and find proof to the contrary; this guy even offers $1000 to anyone who can do it. But you can't do it. The parallels are fabricated.
2 [deleted] 2010-07-31
The New World Order.
When any of the so-called members of the Order are quoted as mentioning it what they are in fact referring to is a stronger form of international law and a reduction in the anarchy of the international order.
It has nothing whatsoever to do with a global dictatorship.
We have much more to fear by the actions of corporations in a lawless global order that we do in a system that enforces a system of international law.
9 CactusMunchies 2010-07-31
But couldnt you see a more stringent international body aiding the expansion of corporate control?
1 [deleted] 2010-07-31
If you can convince me that an almost total lack of enforcement of international law is in some way preferable to the progressive development of a system of law that holds States and corporations accountable, then by all means I will agree that a more stringent international body could aid the expansion of corporate control.
3 ackza 2010-07-31
Its being created RIGHT NOW, it IS the G20 etc etc, that WILL be the global bank that creates LAWS a MERGER of these forces into a legitimate government, enforcing bogus copenhagen treaty environmetal capntrade laws
1 [deleted] 2010-07-31
Something tells me you have no idea what 'bogus copenhagen treaty environmetal capntrade laws' are or how they work.
Amirite?
2 Gr4mp5 2010-07-31
When you are in a place of power... information is the key. The easiest thing to do is to pay great attention to that which will further your cause and carefully ignore that which might take away from your cause which you can then claim ignorance from.
"Who would have guessed that X would happen???" is the common statement by people who have passively or even actively made room for X to happen. No conspiracy is needed with malicious ignorance.
1 ryntau 2010-07-31
the internet
-1 jerseycityfrankie 2010-07-31
chemtrails
6 alllie 2010-07-31
No, there are chemtrails.
5 [deleted] 2010-07-31
Yea, that's a pretty well proven fact- Geoengineering and Chemtrail related patents.
-2 cometparty 2010-07-31
I think the idea that world leaders are plotting to dramatically reduce the population through covert means is bogus.
2 maiden-1 2010-07-31
The moon is the back of the sun
1 eugene_spencer 2010-07-31
Tell me more! Cause I've seen them in the sky at the same time, so...
1 CactusMunchies 2010-07-31
Did someone get the swine flu vaccine?
0 cometparty 2010-07-31
No, actually. I didn't see the need.
1 jayisthedank 2010-07-31
I think it is much more indirect then this. they know that we will do this to ourselves as long as they keep the truth from us. its sort of like the people in power are following a wave of distraction thats been known to take over in this era.
2 FlippyJoeBiscuit 2010-07-31
It is much more then what? What happens next? Who are they and what will we do to ourselves? How stoned are you to make this comment?
1 jayisthedank 2010-07-31
They know that in the evolution of our species there is an obvious pattern. The longer we are around, the more distracted we are from being our true selves. working/evolving with each other and nature for causes that do not involve killing ourselves.
These distractions, naturally caused by human nature and technology, also causes this "ignorance is bliss" thing. People eat, drink, and smoke terrible things without question. This same concept seems to be everywhere, not just consumption.
So, throughout history these people have used this knowledge to help push these ideas subtly (our terrible educational systems, injected meats and foods, wars, diseases, etc) . Thus, "indirectly" reducing the population through covert means.
I have no idea what is coming next,. I just know that by acknowledging these things and separating my thoughts from other peoples ideas, I am a little more prepared than most people
1 cometparty 2010-07-31
You're just talking out your ass.
1 GavriloPrincep 2010-07-31
you may be correct, let's say probably, but what (externally identifiable) things cause you to think this ? There must be something as you have just made an unqualified assertion, and you are sane.
-1 cometparty 2010-07-31
I'm not making the claim. The burden of proof is not on me. There is simply no evidence that they are.
0 free_world 2010-07-31
ACTUALLY, you are making the claim that it's bogus and there is no evidence,so you're not just "questioning". Burden of proof is on you.
0 cometparty 2010-07-31
If only I cared about disproving it to you and not just myself. It's not happening, though. People who think it's happening are feverish schizos.
BTW, with your "logic", you sound like a Bible-thumper.
-2 MysteryShvitz 2010-07-31
The conspiracy theory that says that humans came from monkeys and that we are in fact primates! Listen people, the only science teacher you'll ever need is Pastor Dave from That 70's Show, end of story.
-3 alllie 2010-07-31
Bogus:
Alien visitors.
Claim there was no moon landing.
Jews rule the world. (They just rule the media.)
2012
0 bittermanscolon 2010-07-31
Can you honestly believe we are the only sentient and aware life forms in an infinite universe?
Really? How can you possibly know? You're 1 person on this planet, with ZERO relevant knowledge and information on the subject but you know for sure. No, the internet does not count toward that knowledge.....
I mean, its your opinion.....that's fine....have an opinion......but why have such a staunch opinion on something you can know nothing about???
Would it not be better to say something like, "I believe we are alone, but am open to the possibility that my current knowledge and information is limited and I am not likely to know for sure if that is true or not and could proven wrong at any moment."
But you don't say such a thing which just simply means you don't want to think about the possibility? Am I right?
Why?
0 alllie 2010-07-31
I don't believe aliens have visited earth.
1 bittermanscolon 2010-07-31
So when people video lights and UFO's and the military records these things as well....its all just mass hysteria? Its all in people's heads?
When that Brit hacked NASA and found a document on their system labeled "Non-terrestrial Officers" you know its just for funsies? Its a gag? What is more likely?
How can you come to that conclusion? Again, without any real information one way or another other than the obvious stuff we see on the net and TV.....how can you write that possibility off? Can you know for sure?
Also what is with the down votes? No response, just.....NOPE, YOU'RE WRONG?? Who knows better here? If you know better why not tell us how? Afraid?
1 alllie 2010-07-31
Some of them are hoaxes by people who like to engineer hoaxes. The rest have natural explanations or are tests of new military aircraft or weapon systems.
1 free_world 2010-07-31
Well, it /could/ have been a security "honeypot". I don't deny that he saw what he though.
-3 Occidentalist 2010-07-31
Nazi shrunken heads, soap, & lampshades made from Jews.
2 Britlurker 2010-07-31
Downvotes, really? That must mean there are still people who think the soap & lampshade story is true.
-4 jijimaghi 2010-07-31
That I am thy one and only God.
1 cometparty 2010-07-31
Wat.
1 jayisthedank 2010-07-31
I dont think you understand the theory you are referring to.
Vivek- homeless mans explanation
physicists explaination
2 jijimaghi 2010-07-31
I didn't know there's a theory.... I literally thought I was God for a while... (crazy me)
2 free_world 2010-07-31
Not crazy. Look into "skepticism" from a metaphysics point of view.
-4 xandercruise 2010-07-31
That jews specifically have more power and influence than [edit] rich people in general.
But throw the jews in a pot, add some white europeans, white north americans... baby, you got a stew going
15 [deleted] 2010-07-31
[deleted]
11 xandercruise 2010-07-31
I don't know, but relying on a single biased source like Ognir / TIU is probably not a good idea.
I've read all of these pages and I'm still not convinced. Am I a moron?
5 [deleted] 2010-07-31
[deleted]
2 xandercruise 2010-07-31
Ok, for example, from the Ivy League entry:
I have asked myself this question, and the conclusion I have come to is that the Jews are over-represented in the fields of academia, various sciences, finance, media, information technology etc., because they are:
Perhaps that is a stereotype, but if you've taken a look at the kabbalah and other jewish religious teachings, you'd see that they are extremely complex and require years of deep study and research. Much like the hindu religion(s), studying this shit requires a lot of hard work and brainpower, and makes you a smarter and more capable adult than the average TV-raised dumbed down westerner.
Maybe I'm stereotyping but I've spent years looking into this stuff and have yet to be convinced that the Jewish World Conspiracy theory is more compelling that the Diverse Rich Fuckers World Conspiracy theory (a theory that allows for over-representation of Jews amongst the Diverse Rich Fuckers, due to reason outlined above).
And it's not through lack of research or ignorance... I've told you before I've read much of TIU and listened to lots of their podcasts etc. I've seen everything on WRH and listened to everything Texe Marrs has put out. I've lurked stormfront and just finished reading On the Jews and Their Lies by Martin Luther.
I'm not convinced, and despite the recent rise in postings to this subreddit regarding the Jewish World Conspiracy, I don't think many of us here are convinced either.
But as usual I'll get downvoted for this...
1 [deleted] 2010-07-31
[deleted]
2 xandercruise 2010-07-31
Yes I often post drunk, how can you tell :)
At the moment though I am quite sober as it is only midday here. If anything I've had way too much coffee this morning.
I agree with the whole nepotism/tribalism thing, it is quite obvious, and it supports what I've said above. It doesn't support the overall One World Jewish Order conspiracy theory (well, that theory necessitates a Jew Hive Mind with a singular objective I suppose).
As for thinking Jews are somehow better/smarter me, I would never do such a thing. There's only a handful of people in the world I consider smarter than myself :)
Asians do the nepotism thing too. I think the Japanese are notorious for this, but my friends tell me the Chinese are becoming this way too. The Jews have a much older and established base within the annals of power, finance etc... maybe in 20 years we'll be talking about the Chinese World Order conspiracy theory?
0 ackza 2010-07-31
yes you are, because there are too many jews in high places, its unproportional and they also just hire each other like a sort of affirmative action. White christian male power structure is also not fair but this IS america buddy.
WOlfowitz, kagan, pearl, hank paulson, tim gietner, bernacke, all of the homeland security cheifs, fuck these people, they arent even real jews they are just all zionists,
i am jewish and these people make me ashamed, i dont consider them my people they are some bastard race of pyschopahic killers who hiude behind isreal
3 eugene_spencer 2010-07-31
Well done.
1 ackza 2010-07-31
ya its sucks and makes you look "antisemitic" (which means ANTI PALESTINIAN BTW) but its so true and tiotaly not fair that one group of peopel in a quasi religeioon/ethnicity/nationality can have that much power, maybe in israel but not america, we need more diveristy.n How about a Buddhist federal reserve president?
-7 [deleted] 2010-07-31
That multiple shooters killed JFK. There might be a conspiracy involved with JFK but I think Oswald was the lone shooter.
7 CactusMunchies 2010-07-31
So you agree with the warren report that oswald created all the exit wounds in jfk with a 'magic bullet'?
1 Snow_Monky 2010-07-31
Of course that's true! Oswald was a sentient extra-terrestrial able to bend time and space to allow a single bullet to go through all the exit wounds and ricocheting in the motorcade. It all makes sense, sheeple!
0 [deleted] 2010-07-31
What "magic" bullet? Shot lines up perfectly (see my above link). Everybody just assumes Connelly was sitting directly in front of JFK. When in fact he was sitting slightly to the left, a little lower, and had his body turned. Once when you take into account all these factors, the shot lines up perfectly in a straight line.
2 cometparty 2010-07-31
But his head went "back and to the left."
You don't seem to have studied it very closely. Why did all the people run up the grassy knoll toward where they thought the shot came from? Why was his body mutilated and stolen?
3 Snow_Monky 2010-07-31
That's because he doesn't need to. Oh and it wasn't a straight line. Even public school textbooks show that it wasn't a straight line, hence the magic bullet theory.
1 [deleted] 2010-07-31
Lining up the "magic" bullet
-9 stringerbell 2010-07-31
Well, let's see...
7 Outofmany 2010-07-31
2012 is not a conspiracy
-5 stringerbell 2010-07-31
The conspiracies that say stuff is going to happen on Dec. 21, 2012 are though...
PS. Just to clarify... The NWO actually IS a conspiracy, and it actually IS real. I just used it to point out that the people who rail against it, haven't really thought it out that thoroughly...
3 reeksofhavoc 2010-07-31
http://flouridealert.com
If you dig on the web deep enough you can find out if your state even down to the county still fluoridates their water.